Walk Around the Moon (album) discussion

[TwoStep51901]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

Random thought, but the best live version of Madman's Eyes by far is Holmdel from last year. If they do a bonus disc a la "Rhino's Choice", that should make the cut.

Also, The Only Thing from WPB last year. It's fast, yes. But it's a great version.

SPAC has the best MME, Daves vocals are great

[YankeesDMB41]

I was drunk and on mushrooms, but my recollection of MSG's was that it was fantastic.

[Cardinal]

Originally Posted by anthonysoscia

I'm also confused about WATM. Trying to do the math here.. WATM track will supposedly be 4:49.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMtMuSab2E8
This '22 WATM clocks in at about 5:02. It's already a shortened structure and a little faster tempo, so I'm trying to understand how it could fit into 4:49.

The song could fade out?

[Dannyyankou]

Originally Posted by anthonysoscia

I'm also confused about WATM. Trying to do the math here.. WATM track will supposedly be 4:49.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMtMuSab2E8
This '22 WATM clocks in at about 5:02. It's already a shortened structure and a little faster tempo, so I'm trying to understand how it could fit into 4:49.

I think that around 4:50 of this video is where the studio version will end-

https://youtu.be/Qn4RuFXZdvY

[Simm0nS]

Originally Posted by Cardinal

The song could fade out?

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

I think that around 4:50 of this video is where the studio version will end-

https://youtu.be/Qn4RuFXZdvY

I wouldn't be surprised if they just cut out 10-12 seconds from the beginning of the end jam. Not a while lot going on there and then on the album the jam starts at around the 4:43 mark where Jeff's solo become smore pronounced from the get go.

[Trippingchris]

Following the discussion about the mix on ME....

Listened to the album youtube versions of the Last Stop, So Right to try to get an apples and apples comparison....the mix on ME is questionable indeed. Reminds me very much of the lackluster Busted Stuff mixdown.

[seanbrutus]

Pretty sure this is gonna be a low key album with a more full beginning and end (minus Windows). Otherwise I'm expecting tunes more aligned with OATB than anything else in the middle. Hopefully fleshed out with the band. That's all I really care about. Short or long, at this point it's irrelevant. Give me the band on these other tunes and if they are good, I'll be happy.

[Dannyyankou]

I expect Looking For A Vein, It Could Happen, and Monsters to all be bangers because they're next to very quiet songs.

[groogrux27]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

I expect Looking For A Vein, It Could Happen, and Monsters to all be bangers because they're next to very quiet songs.

I can’t help but think of Kanye’s “Monster” when I saw that there was “Monsters” on this album. Hopefully it’s half as much of a banger as Kanye’s haha

Also, being someone who loves dark themes / music, I need Looking for a Vein to be really dark and good


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[maythekarma1]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

I think that around 4:50 of this video is where the studio version will end-



https://youtu.be/Qn4RuFXZdvY

Having heard that version, I'm now really bummed out that they have cut the jam down.

Why couldn't they just include a 6 minute version for the album?

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[Fpuonpko]

Originally Posted by maythekarma1

Having heard that version, I'm now really bummed out that they have cut the jam down.

Why couldn't they just include a 6 minute version for the album?

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Why not just listen to a high quality live version? I don't get the complaints people have with short studio songs? It's not like they are doing the same version live? And most people I find rarely go back to the studio cuts after the initial listens/when they are new. We have a ton of soundboard/high quality videos and sirius streams of the new songs and we will get even more over the next year especially with this upcoming tour.

[spoot388]

Originally Posted by Fpuonpko

Why not just listen to a high quality live version? I don't get the complaints people have with short studio songs? It's not like they are doing the same version live? And most people I find rarely go back to the studio cuts after the initial listens/when they are new. We have a ton of soundboard/high quality videos and sirius streams of the new songs and we will get even more over the next year especially with this upcoming tour.

but they ARE doing the same thing live as they do on the album. what newer songs have they extended from how they are on their album? it took a decade for them to just think about keep playing the end of sweet for another 2 minutes. songs like #41 and crush are already long on their albums, but they are also recorded in a way that leaves them open to changing how they end. now they are regularly 2-3x longer. the band hasn't done anything like that in years. new songs have stayed how they have been and haven't evolved at all. there is no reason to think these songs will be any different. if they are 3 minutes on the album, they're going to be 3 minutes live, and probably will still be 3 minutes live 5+ years from now.

[Alpine416]

Originally Posted by spoot388

but they ARE doing the same thing live as they do on the album. what newer songs have they extended from how they are on their album? it took a decade for them to just think about keep playing the end of sweet for another 2 minutes. songs like #41 and crush are already long on their albums, but they are also recorded in a way that leaves them open to changing how they end. now they are regularly 2-3x longer. the band hasn't done anything like that in years. new songs have stayed how they have been and haven't evolved at all. there is no reason to think these songs will be any different. if they are 3 minutes on the album, they're going to be 3 minutes live, and probably will still be 3 minutes live 5+ years from now.

TGIY horn outro comes to mind as a newer live enhancement on an otherwise short album song people don't like.

[greywind13]

We'll see how it sounds. WATM is probably still my favorite of the new batch, but it's also the only one that got worse in 2022 compared to 2021. The main thing that made me like WATM more than MME is that it arrived fully formed with plenty of room for everything to breath in the outro. But as long as we get a high quality 2021 version on a LT or WH disc I don't mind them going for a tighter approach on the studio version.

[Cptn. Monkeyman]

Originally Posted by Fpuonpko

Why not just listen to a high quality live version? I don't get the complaints people have with short studio songs? It's not like they are doing the same version live? And most people I find rarely go back to the studio cuts after the initial listens/when they are new. We have a ton of soundboard/high quality videos and sirius streams of the new songs and we will get even more over the next year especially with this upcoming tour.

I'm definitely an album person. I know there are others that often listen to DMBs studio records as well.

[DMBCardinal]

I'm an album person as well. I listen to studio stuff as much as live stuff. I'm okay with songs not being jammed out on the album. I just hope it's good. MME is a good start.

[ToySoldier#34]

Break Free being significantly shorter on the album than it is played live gives me some hope that these songs might not need to be lengthened in the live setting and the shorter lengths are for some reason we're unaware of. It's not ideal for a studio album but I fall into the category of people who look for the live versions.

[Fpuonpko]

I think my point is just that if you want longer/jam songs, you can get those versions live and very easily. If you want a nice studio version, you can get that as well. Both options are available so whether or not the studio album has short songs shouldn't really impact anything.

[ElijahSoRight72]

Originally Posted by Fpuonpko

I think my point is just that if you want longer/jam songs, you can get those versions live and very easily. If you want a nice studio version, you can get that as well. Both options are available so whether or not the studio album has short songs shouldn't really impact anything.

The way I hear music, the album version is the "definitive" version. It doesn't have crowd noise, it's polished, it gets to be the most complete version of a song that it can be. And when they don't care to give these songs the same care in the studio that they do live, I believe it's a disservice to their music. Because in my ideal world, the studio versions are the the place where the songs live up to their very highest potential. When recording a song for a studio album, I want them to ask "how do we make this the best possible version of the song that it can be?" And I'm disappointed that they aren't choosing to let the music be as open and diverse like it could be, in the medium I care about the most.

I'm not trying to change your mind, but just saying "who cares? go listen to your favorite live version" isn't addressing the actual problem I have.

[alec]

I get what you are saying about listening to live versions if you want to hear longer versions, but I personally love really good quality studio recordings. I always go back to UTTAD, C, BTCS, BS, and BWGK over live versions of most of the songs. I would go back to studio versions of the other albums IF they recorded better versions. B&BB is a perfect example. I REALLY want a studio version that is like the live versions (maybe with a verse and chorus cut out since they do so many) but with the same kind of ending part. They could have easily done that, but instead they did what they did on CT, and I could easily go the rest of my life with never hearing it again.

Not trying to take anything away from people who prefer live versions. More power to you. However, I don’t think I am entirely alone in regularly going back to great studio recordings regularly and find it frustrating that they often times don’t get it right in the studio when we all know they easily could.

Having said that, MME is great and I love the way the studio version came out.

[Fpuonpko]

I get what you guys are saying as well, and I agree to an extent. The "Crowd nose" though shouldn't be a mark against it. We do have several improved sources lately, including members here doing remasters where the crowd noise is almost non existent and you can almost think you are losing yourself in a studio version. I'm not talking about taper pulls which while nice, miss the mark a lot. I just am happy we at least have different versions and variety around. Of course I would love a jam packed studio album of 80 minutes but at least I can get some really solid sounding versions elsewhere as well.

It would also be cool if they recorded 2 versions of an album with "Radio edits" and then full, jammed out versions - and even did it digitally only as a bonus so it could go beyond the CD lengths if needed.

[spoot388]

Originally Posted by Alpine416

TGIY horn outro comes to mind as a newer live enhancement on an otherwise short album song people don't like.

ok, so there is one 30 second section they added. first off, it makes no sense to not include that on the album, especially with TGIY being a single. why wouldn't you want the most catchy and fun part of a song included on something you're putting out to get people's attention? second, outside of when PHJB guests, they do nothing with that section. its been 4 years now and as far as i know they haven't had a single solo during that section if PHJB isn't playing. why not let buddy solo over the horns for a couple minutes? why is trying something like that so hard for them to even think of doing these days?

if you look at their live performances, their songs average about 7 minutes. adding a 2 minute solo during the jam of TGIY isn't some ridiculous ask or expectation. its literally just wanting them to do their average/standard/typical thing.

Originally Posted by Fpuonpko

I think my point is just that if you want longer/jam songs, you can get those versions live and very easily. If you want a nice studio version, you can get that as well. Both options are available so whether or not the studio album has short songs shouldn't really impact anything.

they don't play longer versions of most of these newer songs though. there is no other version to listen to. that's the problem. they treat all these newer songs like they are satellite instead of treating them like rapunzel. we're not asking for them to make all these songs 12-15 minutes long. their live song average time is 7 minutes. add 2-3 minutes of a jam to them like they've done to so many songs in the past. it shouldn't be this difficult to do.

if songs like crush and #41 were written today, they wouldn't be anywhere close to being the songs we love and hope to hear at shows. the crush radio edit would be the only version of the song and #41 would fade out after the violin solo.

[anthonysoscia]

To add to this, studio albums are what the masses hear. Us hardcore fans will have nice live recordings, but it’s the studio recordings that go the furthest and could make or break someone becoming a fan, to some extent. Also, ik it’s DMB, but studio albums carry much more weight for their legacy. There’s obviously much respect for live DMB recordings, but it’s just the way it is. Like ElijahSoRight72 said, the studio is the definitive version.

Steve Lillywhite has said something along the lines of, “Once a solo is recorded in the studio, it becomes a part.” That’s the weight of studio albums. Think of all of Roi’s improvised soloing and countermelodies on studio records that became ‘parts’ live.

[Fpuonpko]

Originally Posted by spoot388

they don't play longer versions of most of these newer songs though. there is no other version to listen to. that's the problem. they treat all these newer songs like they are satellite instead of treating them like rapunzel. we're not asking for them to make all these songs 12-15 minutes long. their live song average time is 7 minutes. add 2-3 minutes of a jam to them like they've done to so many songs in the past. it shouldn't be this difficult to do.

I guess I am confused on this point


Break Free obviously has been around the longest so there are clearly several versions nearly double the studio length



Walk around the moon - there is an official released version (streaming) that is 6:17. the studio version is under 5 minutes. That is nearly 2 minutes longer.


Madmans Eyes official version from Fall 2022 is 6:26. The album cut is under 5. Another song nearly 2 minutes longer.

[bibby1044]

Originally Posted by anthonysoscia

To add to this, studio albums are what the masses hear. Us hardcore fans will have nice live recordings, but it’s the studio recordings that go the furthest and could make or break someone becoming a fan, to some extent. Also, ik it’s DMB, but studio albums carry much more weight for their legacy. There’s obviously much respect for live DMB recordings, but it’s just the way it is. Like ElijahSoRight72 said, the studio is the definitive version.

Steve Lillywhite has said something along the lines of, “Once a solo is recorded in the studio, it becomes a part.” That’s the weight of studio albums. Think of all of Roi’s improvised soloing and countermelodies on studio records that became ‘parts’ live.

Exactly this. That’s so true. It’s a part.

And the problem is new songs don’t get expanded upon live if they aren’t that way in the studio. What you hear is what you get so let’s stop acting like that’s an excuse to remove “parts” from a studio record.

I find it very odd the band wouldn’t want to tinker around with songs and jams in the studio because it’s just as that…it’s fun. Like record the base of the song that you’re currently giving us on the album and experiment a bit. So odd they just don’t do this anymore.

[crounsa810]

Since Big Whiskey, what studio songs have really ended up being expanded beyond the album structure?

LITHOG
Spaceman
Mercy (and then never played it again)
Sweet
Rooftop
Snow Outside
TGIY
I guess maybe COCO?

Not a great track record

[bibby1044]

Originally Posted by crounsa810

Since Big Whiskey, what studio songs have really ended up being expanded beyond the album structure?

LITHOG
Spaceman
Mercy (and then never played it again)
Sweet
Rooftop
Snow Outside
TGIY
I guess maybe COCO?

Not a great track record

Sweet and beachball are two of the best jams they’ve done in a long long time but are much different than many you mentioned above

[crounsa810]

Expanding off of that, they really should’ve expanded on these by now, especially with how many of them they play them to death:

Shake Me
Funny
Why I Am
Squirm
Seven
The Riff
Drunken Soldier should’ve had a better outro by now
Can’t Stop (idk, maybe add the middle eastern bit back?)
Do You Remember

[crounsa810]

Originally Posted by bibby1044

Sweet and beachball are two of the best jams they’ve done in a long long time but are much different than many you mentioned above

I’d agree. I wish they’d do more of that vs. just playing the standard. Shake Me would be a lot more tolerable if it had a Jimi-esque horn jam. I was super disappointed they had all those horns on stage at MSG and just played it normal. Remember when Satellite had that little mid jam a few years ago that promptly went away? That was great. More stuff like that would really re-energize these shows.

[crounsa810]

Originally Posted by YankeesDMB41

I was drunk and on mushrooms, but my recollection of MSG's was that it was fantastic.

It sounds great on the tape, it just has a few lyric misses