General Discussion on Setlists as a Whole This Year

[TheLastPig]

They know what the hardcore fans want, thats why they bust them out at destination venues.

Regular tour stops theyre basically on auto pilot, play what I want to play and dont care about the hardcore fans at those venues who arent traveling to gorge, spac, alpine etc.

[Bmwm3oz]

Originally Posted by dmbnut21

I mean, he sort of has to do this, doesn't he? If he ever (even once) playing whatever one guy screamed out he would get 20x the amount of people yelling shit out and if he did comply we would have Crash at every show because some drunk chick won't shut up.

From what I have seen, the band (or Dave) does listen. From what I can tell if you put in real effort, they put in real effort. Not every time but sometimes. Here are my examples:

-Red Rocks 05- The entire crowd chants Halloween over and over and over. They do it.
-Let You Down - Was requested through back channels and it happened.
-2013ish? - Girl goes to shows over and over asking for Write a Song with a poster. Dave then stops seeing her. She then shows up again and he says, there you are! You kept saying play this song, play this song and then when I was ready you weren't there any more. Well, here it is.
-Some chick in the early-mid 2000s used to throw stuffed pigs on the stage at all the time in Texas. I remember seeing her in almost every year in Dallas and Houston. I remember talking with her after she threw one up and she seemed confident it was happening. Maybe it was just a coincidence but the song wasn't being played that regularly and it happened multiple times in Texas.

I don't think the band is every going to come out one night and say, tonight we are playing 75% B-sides and rarities (although n3 of that mexico show with D&T was close and I'm jealous AF of that show). However, I think if you get their attention the do at least consider it. The band does pay attention in general.

Originally Posted by TheLastPig

They know what the hardcore fans want, thats why they bust them out at destination venues.

Regular tour stops theyre basically on auto pilot, play what I want to play and dont care about the hardcore fans at those venues who arent traveling to gorge, spac, alpine etc.

True. Seems like bottom line is they know what 'hardcore' or 'old' fans want, and they expect those fans to show up to Spac & Gorge (sometimes Alpine). I guess I feel bad for those who can't easily get to one of these venues, because you're stuck with mostly repetitive setlists.

[dmbnut21]

Originally Posted by Bmwm3oz

True. Seems like bottom line is they know what 'hardcore' or 'old' fans want, and they expect those fans to show up to Spac & Gorge (sometimes Alpine). I guess I feel bad for those who can't easily get to one of these venues, because you're stuck with mostly repetitive setlists.

I mean, this is fairly true but not entirely true. I do feel like the biggest gems/rarities do tend to be saved for the destination venues but there are a lot of solid tunes that get broken out at regular venues. I think Dallas is a good example. We get 1 show a year here and have every tour since 2005, so 12 shows from 05-18. Here are the things we have gotten:

2005 - Everybody Wake Up (Song Debut- late in tour - only played 5 times)
2006 - Nothing Special - What You Are maybe
2007 - Dream So Real, Loving Wings, Typical>Grace>Black Water
2008 - Stolen Away, ASTB>TM (Fake)>Halloween>Ants
2009 - Sort of sucked. Right before BW came out so it was a bland set.
2010 - Last Stop Opener
2012 - If I Had It All (Tour opener - only time IIHIA was played in 2012)
2013 - Great set but nothing rare.
2014 - Decent set, nothing truely rare.
2015 - I'll Back You Up
2016 - Dive In (liberated), Last Stop, Ditch, Sugar Will
2018 - You Never Know, She (debut), Steady as We Go (liberated)

Not claiming you should all come to Dallas, just saying that for a random venue this is all pretty good stuff.

[crounsa810]

I messaged Rashawn about them segueing PNP into something besides Rapunzel, and gave a list of potential good ones they could do. Ended up getting PNP>LIOG 2 days later in Philly.

[TheLastPig]

Originally Posted by dmbnut21

I mean, this is fairly true but not entirely true. I do feel like the biggest gems/rarities do tend to be saved for the destination venues but there are a lot of solid tunes that get broken out at regular venues. I think Dallas is a good example. We get 1 show a year here and have every tour since 2005, so 12 shows from 05-18. Here are the things we have gotten:

2005 - Everybody Wake Up (Song Debut- late in tour - only played 5 times)
2006 - Nothing Special - What You Are maybe
2007 - Dream So Real, Loving Wings, Typical>Grace>Black Water
2008 - Stolen Away, ASTB>TM (Fake)>Halloween>Ants
2009 - Sort of sucked. Right before BW came out so it was a bland set.
2010 - Last Stop Opener
2012 - If I Had It All (Tour opener - only time IIHIA was played in 2012)
2013 - Great set but nothing rare.
2014 - Decent set, nothing truely rare.
2015 - I'll Back You Up
2016 - Dive In (liberated), Last Stop, Ditch, Sugar Will
2018 - You Never Know, She (debut), Steady as We Go (liberated)

Not claiming you should all come to Dallas, just saying that for a random venue this is all pretty good stuff.

No doubt there are outliers but those are exceptions to the rule and its completely random. Early in the tour is always a good shot to see something unique, then it completely drops off and gets maybe 1-2 more plays the rest of the tour.

[westwingjl]

In Kansas in 2015, they played Pig in the encore because of a bunch of people in the pit holding Pig signs. YMDT was setlisted.

[ToySoldier#34]

Brought back KKJ for Sam Berns, 2018 played a request at SPAC, Farm Aid, etc.

[Dannyyankou]

Originally Posted by ToySoldier#34

Brought back KKJ for Sam Berns, 2018 played a request at SPAC, Farm Aid, etc.

I mean they didn't really "bring it back", it was played at the tour opener in Hartford and was played a couple times after that before being dedicated to Sam in Mansfield a couple weeks later.

[Dannyyankou]

By the way, the setlists are lame but Carter is sounding really good on this European tour. He's doing fills on songs I haven't heard him do in years.

[snow1868]

Originally Posted by dmbnut21

I mean, this is fairly true but not entirely true. I do feel like the biggest gems/rarities do tend to be saved for the destination venues but there are a lot of solid tunes that get broken out at regular venues. I think Dallas is a good example. We get 1 show a year here and have every tour since 2005, so 12 shows from 05-18. Here are the things we have gotten:

2005 - Everybody Wake Up (Song Debut- late in tour - only played 5 times)
2006 - Nothing Special - What You Are maybe
2007 - Dream So Real, Loving Wings, Typical>Grace>Black Water
2008 - Stolen Away, ASTB>TM (Fake)>Halloween>Ants
2009 - Sort of sucked. Right before BW came out so it was a bland set.
2010 - Last Stop Opener
2012 - If I Had It All (Tour opener - only time IIHIA was played in 2012)
2013 - Great set but nothing rare.
2014 - Decent set, nothing truely rare.
2015 - I'll Back You Up
2016 - Dive In (liberated), Last Stop, Ditch, Sugar Will
2018 - You Never Know, She (debut), Steady as We Go (liberated)

Not claiming you should all come to Dallas, just saying that for a random venue this is all pretty good stuff.

Uh, that opening run in 2006 was killer with BOWA, Jane, Say Bye, Pig, and LIOG.

I've had great shows in Dallas with "The Invasion of the Crickets" in '98 being the best.

[Titotimmy]

I could see Stefan hate following this thread

[ToySoldier#34]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

I mean they didn't really "bring it back", it was played at the tour opener in Hartford and was played a couple times after that before being dedicated to Sam in Mansfield a couple weeks later.

Ah that's right, I mean they obviously take requests frequently but it'll be from someone like Sam or along those lines as opposed to fans holding up signs at a show which I'm perfectly fine with.

[Bmwm3oz]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

By the way, the setlists are lame but Carter is sounding really good on this European tour. He's doing fills on songs I haven't heard him do in years.

That's amazing to hear.

Originally Posted by Titotimmy

I could see Stefan hate following this thread

no joke..

[Dannyyankou]

Originally Posted by Titotimmy

I could see Stefan hate following this thread

Oh he definitely checks in on these forums, he’s tweeted about this site before.

[SeeMoreDMB]

It seems like they try to find a healthy balance as far as playing songs requested at shows with signs or in other fashions. Like someone said, they obviously can't do it every time because that would open the floodgates, but I remember at SPAC last year there was a sign that said "Do You Remember #40?" And Dave did a partial version. There's also a video where he fucks up Whiter Shade then plays Space Between because of a sign.

[Bmwm3oz]

[/INDENT]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

Oh he definitely checks in on these forums, he’s tweeted about this site before.

I really hope he doesn't.. at least lately. If he opens up this forum and see's 'Stefan's Twitter' on the front page, he'll end up further in his head and we'll probably cause him a nervous breakdown. The dude already sits in his hotel room and gets up in his head over fan comments.

[LetYouDown22]

I could see Dave giggling as writes the setlists after reading this thread.....then passing it along to the other band members....and then sharing one giant burst of laughter before taking the stage.

[pathetic]

Originally Posted by LetYouDown22

I could see Dave giggling as writes the setlists after reading this thread.....then passing it along to the other band members....and then sharing one giant burst of laughter before taking the stage.

i would feel better about this band if that's what he was doing. similar to that "Pig" show where he teases it multiple times and jokes via IEM to the band about it.

unfortunately dave is just lazy and has bad taste in his own music

[dmbnut21]

Originally Posted by snow1868

Uh, that opening run in 2006 was killer with BOWA, Jane, Say Bye, Pig, and LIOG.

I've had great shows in Dallas with "The Invasion of the Crickets" in '98 being the best.

I'm not saying it wasn't a good run or that it was a bad show (although 2:08 and 16 songs is a short set). My point was more about rarity and gems. Each of those songs has been played 400+ times (Pig is only at 187, LIOG though is at 800).

I think Dallas gets good shows. Sadly, I didn't start going until 2001... regrets because the 2000 shows I think are great too.

My entire point was - Yes, "destination venues" get better sets. Part of that though is that they are multi-night shows. However, to act like every other show they play is just them homing it in isn't really fair or accurate. Every regularly played venue has gotten several rare songs/gems over the years.

Dave does play what he wants but he does a good job of mixing it up too, even though EU has looked a little bland so far.

Reality - If you went only to the shows in Dallas at Smirnoff (there has been 17 shows) so this excludes the 2001 Texas Stadium Show and the 2002-2004 shows that were at American Airlines Center you would still have seen 117 different songs. That's pretty damn good for a venue that has only had 1 two night stand the entire time.

[SeeMoreDMB]

Originally Posted by dmbnut21

I'm not saying it wasn't a good run or that it was a bad show (although 2:08 and 16 songs is a short set). My point was more about rarity and gems. Each of those songs has been played 400+ times (Pig is only at 187, LIOG though is at 800).

I think Dallas gets good shows. Sadly, I didn't start going until 2001... regrets because the 2000 shows I think are great too.

My entire point was - Yes, "destination venues" get better sets. Part of that though is that they are multi-night shows. However, to act like every other show they play is just them homing it in isn't really fair or accurate. Every regularly played venue has gotten several rare songs/gems over the years.

Dave does play what he wants but he does a good job of mixing it up too, even though EU has looked a little bland so far.

Reality - If you went only to the shows in Dallas at Smirnoff (there has been 17 shows) so this excludes the 2001 Texas Stadium Show and the 2002-2004 shows that were at American Airlines Center you would still have seen 117 different songs. That's pretty damn good for a venue that has only had 1 two night stand the entire time.

Not that Hartford isn't known for some legendary shows, but now that it's a single night stop they still tend to play killer sets. Last year had the liberation of Captain and the only B&BB of the year. I consider myself lucky to be only 30 minutes from there and two hours from SPAC.

[snow1868]

Originally Posted by dmbnut21

I'm not saying it wasn't a good run or that it was a bad show (although 2:08 and 16 songs is a short set). My point was more about rarity and gems. Each of those songs has been played 400+ times (Pig is only at 187, LIOG though is at 800).

I think Dallas gets good shows. Sadly, I didn't start going until 2001... regrets because the 2000 shows I think are great too.

My entire point was - Yes, "destination venues" get better sets. Part of that though is that they are multi-night shows. However, to act like every other show they play is just them homing it in isn't really fair or accurate. Every regularly played venue has gotten several rare songs/gems over the years.

Dave does play what he wants but he does a good job of mixing it up too, even though EU has looked a little bland so far.

Reality - If you went only to the shows in Dallas at Smirnoff (there has been 17 shows) so this excludes the 2001 Texas Stadium Show and the 2002-2004 shows that were at American Airlines Center you would still have seen 117 different songs. That's pretty damn good for a venue that has only had 1 two night stand the entire time.

I agree with you, but when you look at the sets that were played before and after the Dallas '06 show, it stands out a little more. In '06, you could call the opener every three shows it seemed like as they'd hit their usual second leg coasting. But then pow, BOWA opens out of nowhere and a run of songs that looked like a show from '98. And like you, I regret missing the 2000 shows as I was in Stillwater but I decided to stay in town instead of the five hour drive for that weekend.

I've gotten some decent 'one-off' shows at non-destination venues, Dallas being a few, Kansas City '09, and Tampa '16 were all enjoyable while not being super rare.

[karczews41]

Originally Posted by pathetic

i would feel better about this band if that's what he was doing. similar to that "Pig" show where he teases it multiple times and jokes via IEM to the band about it.

unfortunately dave is just lazy and has bad taste in his own music

The "Dave is lazy" line gets thrown out far too often in this and other threads, which is, ironically, just lazy criticism. The guy tours like a machine and has for nearly 3 decades. When he's not playing DMB, he's doing D&T, solos or charity events (see 2017). He's tireless in support of causes he believes in, and has cranked out a good amount of widely well-received records. Could he write more varied sets - absolutely. But not doing so does not make him lazy - if anything it makes him complacent in loving the way a select small group of songs sound with the current makeup of the band. And seeing he and other band members performing that small group of songs shows no signs of laziness either, whether you like the songs they're playing or not they still appear to be giving 100% every time out there. Again, lazy is not the right critique.

[Bmwm3oz]

Originally Posted by karczews41

The "Dave is lazy" line gets thrown out far too often in this and other threads, which is, ironically, just lazy criticism. The guy tours like a machine and has for nearly 3 decades. When he's not playing DMB, he's doing D&T, solos or charity events (see 2017). He's tireless in support of causes he believes in, and has cranked out a good amount of widely well-received records. Could he write more varied sets - absolutely. But not doing so does not make him lazy - if anything it makes him complacent in loving the way a select small group of songs sound with the current makeup of the band. And seeing he and other band members performing that small group of songs shows no signs of laziness either, whether you like the songs they're playing or not they still appear to be giving 100% every time out there. Again, lazy is not the right critique.

Andddd it's this post again. I'm too lazy to explain why Dave is considered lazy by many of us in 2019 again.. Bottom line, Dave is lazy in 2018'2019 whatever, when comparing to the preparation he used to do for shows back in the day. Look at 2010. The time & effort they put into the sets. Changing up songs, fakes etc. They don't do any of this anymore.

Jeff said it.. on the day of shows, they aren't meeting up anymore. They are out drinking coffee, riding bikes, exercising etc. Priorities have changed. They know they can still put on a show (just not as great as before) without preparing much. Shutting up now..

[RiotAct]

yes, he's very lazy when compared to the incredibly high standards he set for himself in the 90s and early 2000s, I'll give you that.

[misschung]

They aren't getting back to those days any time soon

[karczews41]

Originally Posted by Bmwm3oz

Andddd it's this post again. I'm too lazy to explain why Dave is considered lazy by many of us in 2019 again.. Bottom line, Dave is lazy in 2018'2019 whatever, when comparing to the preparation he used to do for shows back in the day. Look at 2010. The time & effort they put into the sets. Changing up songs, fakes etc. They don't do any of this anymore.

Jeff said it.. on the day of shows, they aren't meeting up anymore. They are out drinking coffee, riding bikes, exercising etc. Priorities have changed. They know they can still put on a show (just not as great as before) without preparing much. Shutting up now..

Read above. That's complacency, not laziness.

[Bmwm3oz]

Originally Posted by RiotAct

yes, he's very lazy when compared to the incredibly high standards he set for himself in the 90s and early 2000s, I'll give you that.

As much as I complain, I can't blame Dave/the band.

If I'm in a band in my 50's, I'm checking out Paris in the AM, maybe a workout in the PM, followed by dinner with the family (if they are on the road), or go check out a movie.. I mean, can you imagine touring for as many years as they have and doing the same freaking thing day in and day out?

[ExistenceNow]

com·pla·cen·cy
/kəmˈplāsənsē/
noun
noun: complacency; noun: complacence

a feeling of smug or uncritical satisfaction with oneself or one's achievements.


Is that better than lazy?

[Bmwm3oz]

Originally Posted by karczews41

Read above. That's complacency, not laziness.

Feels like semantics to me. He knows the fans go wild for sets at SPAC & Gorge. He knows fans think these are the best shows. Why can't he provide this type of variety in sets, changing up songs for most venues? Because he's complacent, or lazy? What difference does it make. Both attitudes are not good for a career.

[ToySoldier#34]

Originally Posted by Bmwm3oz

Feels like semantics to me. He knows the fans go wild for sets at SPAC & Gorge. He knows fans think these are the best shows. Why can't he provide this type of variety in sets, changing up songs for most venues? Because he's complacent, or lazy? What difference does it make. Both attitudes are not good for a career.

It should take equal amount of effort to write a good set or a bad set, I kind of like that he caters towards certain venues personally