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Old 05-20-2019, 09:43 AM   #148861
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Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

https://www.mediamatters.org/blog/20...ttigieg/223745

I’m glad Pete went on FNC, but this is also a great example of why they will not get anymore dems


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  • Old 05-20-2019, 09:46 AM   #148862
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DMBstandUP1984 View Post
    https://www.mediamatters.org/blog/20...ttigieg/223745

    I’m glad Pete went on FNC, but this is also a great example of why they will not get anymore dems


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    additionally, the president of the united states gives media access almost exclusively to fox news, and makes zero effort to reach out and address or hear from anyone outside of his base. but somehow, democrats get tsk tsk’d if they aren’t interested in courting trump’s base? it’s nonsense.

    https://twitter.com/mattgertz/status...384739842?s=21

    “There is a distinct lack of concern-trolling thinkpieces questioning how a president who got 46% of the vote and virtually only does national TV interviews on Fox can possibly reach the majority of voters who opposed his election.”

    https://www.mediamatters.org/blog/20...usiness/223676
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    Old 05-20-2019, 09:47 AM   #148863
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cazzie34 View Post
    Just answer the question. Plenty of murders go unsolved now but murder is still illegal.
    Not something I prioritize
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    Old 05-20-2019, 09:55 AM   #148864
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ShotgunDMB View Post
    Not something I prioritize
    Another non answer.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 09:57 AM   #148865
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Finding murderers shouldn't be a priority.

    That's a new one
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    Old 05-20-2019, 09:57 AM   #148866
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DMBstandUP1984 View Post
    https://www.mediamatters.org/blog/20...ttigieg/223745

    I’m glad Pete went on FNC, but this is also a great example of why they will not get anymore dems
    This is why I think it's worth debating the merits of going on.

    If they're just going to run a negative disinformation campaign against you no matter what, why throw chum in that water?
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    Old 05-20-2019, 09:59 AM   #148867
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    I'm trying to word this carefully because it will almost certainly be twisted, but the allowance of a rape/incest exception by the right has always been slightly off-putting to me because it feels like it implies that an unwanted pregnancy is an acceptable punishment for irresponsible sex in most cases, but it's not for rape/incest victims because they didn't choose that action.

    Now, rape/incest victims certainly deserve our sympathy, love and support for the terrifying events they had to go through, but so do all mothers of unwanted pregnancies. I don't want to judge any of them for what specific events led to their unwanted pregnancy and act like some are more or less deserving of getting out of the punishment of pregnancy. It's always a scary, life-altering development for someone not expecting it and anyone in that position deserves support.

    But the pro-life movement is supposed to be about protecting the life inside the mother and not at all about the events that led to that life being there. I don't know why the organized pro-life movement gets baited into talking about this rape/incest issue because it implies that we are judging the means by which that life arrives in the womb, when it shouldn't matter - the life is there and they should do their best to protect it.

    And I feel like in today's world the best way to protect it is to figure out policy that encourages women to carry a baby to term and gives her all the support in terms of leave, employment protection, etc., whether they intend to keep the baby or give it up for adoption. I don't think that necessarily has to be in place before abortion is outlawed - because again, if you believe it is a life then the deaths have to stop now - but some acknowledgment that they empathize with the issues faced by ALL mothers of unwanted pregnancy instead of just mothers from rape and incest, and are working towards ways to support them, would make their stance on abortion a lot easier to swallow IMO.

    Last edited by MOWJO8185; 05-20-2019 at 10:00 AM.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 10:23 AM   #148868
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Mowjo, I appreciate your thoughtful views on this, and I think I can credible claim I am as much of a moderate on this site regarding the issue (although I do consider myself pro choice). But forcing a rape victim, and in particular a child, to carry a baby to term, does not show the respect for her life at all.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 10:23 AM   #148869
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MOWJO8185 View Post
    but some acknowledgment that they empathize with the issues faced by ALL mothers of unwanted pregnancy instead of just mothers from rape and incest, and are working towards ways to support them, would make their stance on abortion a lot easier to swallow IMO.
    The rest of the post aside, this is a really great point
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    Old 05-20-2019, 10:23 AM   #148870
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Forcing any person to carry a fetus to term that they don't want does not show respect for their life.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 10:26 AM   #148871
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by coldengrey12 View Post
    Forcing any person to carry a fetus to term that they don't want does not show respect for their life.
    Disagree. Allowing women to abort at any time for any reason shows a disrespect for life as well. Yes I know it's rare. But allowing that option means it will happen.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 10:30 AM   #148872
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Lee3691 View Post
    Disagree. Allowing women to abort at any time for any reason shows a disrespect for life as well. Yes I know it's rare. But allowing that option means it will happen.
    If you have the right, people are going to abuse it. That's just an unfortunate reality.

    I'd still rather have it and have people abuse it than no one have the right.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 10:30 AM   #148873
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Still, I find it very hard to believe that someone is going to carry for eight months and be like, "Nah, fuck this" unless there's a medical emergency or the fetus isn't viable.

    Or that there will be medical professionals who don't encourage other outcomes.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 10:35 AM   #148874
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    In happier thoughts, Nigel Farage got milkshaked.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 10:41 AM   #148875
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by coldengrey12 View Post
    If you have the right, people are going to abuse it. That's just an unfortunate reality.

    I'd still rather have it and have people abuse it than no one have the right.
    Do you apply this logic to guns, drugs, etc?
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    Old 05-20-2019, 10:41 AM   #148876
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by coldengrey12 View Post
    In happier thoughts, Nigel Farage got milkshaked.
    LOL

    Paul Joseph Watson is going to have an aneurysm.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:06 AM   #148877
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cazzie34 View Post
    Another non answer.
    You just gotta get a gotcha moment here don’t you
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:12 AM   #148878
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Lee3691 View Post
    Mowjo, I appreciate your thoughtful views on this, and I think I can credible claim I am as much of a moderate on this site regarding the issue (although I do consider myself pro choice). But forcing a rape victim, and in particular a child, to carry a baby to term, does not show the respect for her life at all.
    Thanks for this. When I talk about the rape/incest exception, I admittedly only really think about the first of those word, and in that only in the context of a legal adult. The bolded above made me very squeamish and I appreciate you challenging me on my thinking.

    I think my larger point was that I don't love how exceptions for rape/incest in some way implies that other women are getting what they deserve. I'd like see acknowledgment of how life-altering and scary it is and pro-woman policies from the right for all women who are facing an unwanted pregnancy.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:23 AM   #148879
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    I like Farage. Interesting bloke
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:24 AM   #148880
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    "President Trump is preparing to instruct his former White House counsel, Donald F. McGahn II, to defy a congressional subpoena and skip a hearing scheduled for Tuesday, denying Democrats testimony from one of the most important eyewitnesses to Mr. Trump’s attempts to obstruct the Russia investigation, a person briefed on the matter said on Monday.

    The House Judiciary Committee has subpoenaed Mr. McGahn to appear. The White House plans to provide Mr. McGahn, who left the post last year, with a legal opinion from the Justice Department to justify his defying the subpoena, the person said."
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:26 AM   #148881
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MOWJO8185 View Post

    I think my larger point was that I don't love how exceptions for rape/incest in some way implies that other women are getting what they deserve. I'd like see acknowledgment of how life-altering and scary it is and pro-woman policies from the right for all women who are facing an unwanted pregnancy.
    Truthfully, the incest exception is kind of weird too because I guess 99.9% of females who are pregnant with a baby from her father (or other close relatives) have been raped. I think that being victim of a violent crime like rape victims are, forcing her to carry that baby to term, can have such a drastic psychological and physical impact on her life that is probably different then other pregnant women have to go through.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:33 AM   #148882
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    The notion that making abortion illegal is going to prevent it from happening is ludicrous. All it will do is make getting one less safe and put already disadvantaged people in jail. A politician in West Virginia, after Brett Kavanaugh was confirmed, posted on social media the words “Better get you’re (sic) coathangers ready liberals.” There is a large portion of the forced birth crowd who are aware of this and refuse to acknowledge the reality of the situation in order to gain political points.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:33 AM   #148883
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    ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ShotgunDMB View Post
    Jailing mothers isn’t something I support.


    If they are accessories to murder, why aren’t they subject to jail time? Shotty soft on crime.
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    CNN headline - Court gives baker narrow win in gay wedding cake case
    7-2 is narrow now
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:34 AM   #148884
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cazzie34 View Post
    "President Trump is preparing to instruct his former White House counsel, Donald F. McGahn II, to defy a congressional subpoena and skip a hearing scheduled for Tuesday, denying Democrats testimony from one of the most important eyewitnesses to Mr. Trump’s attempts to obstruct the Russia investigation, a person briefed on the matter said on Monday.

    The House Judiciary Committee has subpoenaed Mr. McGahn to appear. The White House plans to provide Mr. McGahn, who left the post last year, with a legal opinion from the Justice Department to justify his defying the subpoena, the person said."
    Of course.

    Interested to see what the DoJ's 'legal opinion' is.
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:34 AM   #148885
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by coldengrey12 View Post
    Forcing any person to carry a fetus to term that they don't want does not show respect for their life.
    Why hold yourself accountable for sex when you can just abort the problem & go out and party!!! Wooooohooooo
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:37 AM   #148886
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    We have an accountability problem in the United States, no one wants to hold themselves accountable for their actions - just want to lay blame and force others to bail them out
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:38 AM   #148887
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Brohan_Santana View Post
    Why hold yourself accountable for sex when you can just abort the problem & go out and party!!! Wooooohooooo


    Non sequitur
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    CNN headline - Court gives baker narrow win in gay wedding cake case
    7-2 is narrow now
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:41 AM   #148888
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by YouKnowThatItIS View Post
    The notion that making abortion illegal is going to prevent it from happening is ludicrous. All it will do is make getting one less safe and put already disadvantaged people in jail. A politician in West Virginia, after Brett Kavanaugh was confirmed, posted on social media the words “Better get you’re (sic) coathangers ready liberals.” There is a large portion of the forced birth crowd who are aware of this and refuse to acknowledge the reality of the situation in order to gain political points.
    So you think net net the number of abortions stay the same if it becomes illegal nationally?
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:44 AM   #148889
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Has any republican commented on amash?
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    Old 05-20-2019, 11:44 AM   #148890
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    Re: ** The Trump Thread SAFE SPACE ** (NO Personal Attacks; NO Trolling)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Brohan_Santana View Post
    We have an accountability problem in the United States, no one wants to hold themselves accountable for their actions - just want to lay blame and force others to bail them out
    Are you talking about Trump?
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