The NHL Thread

[fonzz41]

Originally Posted by swordo84

You can't send the Sedin line out, you just can't. Henrick was (is) hurt to the point he couldn't finish the game. The Flames line had no intention of playing the puck. Wesgarth didn't even look at it as it was dropped, they would have instantly pounded the crap out of the turtling Swedes.

Torts was in a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

Exactly. People are outside their minds if they think McGratton and Westgarth all of a sudden would've started attempting to play the game the minute the Sedins came out. "Oh, it's the Sedins... I guess we won't do what our coach put us out here to do anymore and just waste this shift trying to match up skill-wise against them." (translation from cave man).

Originally Posted by JRS1386

If anything I would thing Vancouver's 4th line would want to go out there in that situation to protect the first line from what was obviously going to be a rough start of the game

Great point. Tortorella would instantly lose the respect of his team if he sent their less-able brothers into that situation. I'm pretty sure someone like Bieksa would've stepped up and been like, "uhhh Coach..." That's just how hockey players are with each other.

[fonzz41]

Originally Posted by TMoore4075

I'm ok with it being a niche sport to a point. but the NHL keeps shooting itself in the foot with crap like this. Part of the reason I like it being a niche sport is this board. Compare our thread to the NFL one. 99% of us know the game very well in here. Go to the NFL thread and you get a lot of people who think they know the game. It's nice to be able to talk civilized about the game.

Absolutely. Right amounts of press, but for precisely the wrong reasons.

That's why I love this thread too.

[fonzz41]

What's funny is Tortorella has done the same thing he was getting pissed at Hartley about. Just ask ol' Pete DeBoer.

[TMoore4075]

Originally Posted by fonzz41

What's funny is Tortorella has done the same thing he was getting pissed at Hartley about. Just ask ol' Pete DeBoer.

Yeah I read that yesterday I think. Always funny you can do something, but someone else does the same thing to you and it's terrible.

[TMoore4075]

Wings get monster back and lose Jimmy Howard for at least a week. Datsyuk, Franzen and Alfie all skated today but none play Wednesday. One day I'll get to see the team I had hoped for at the start of the season....one day.

[aclark0622]

Originally Posted by fonzz41

Exactly. People are outside their minds if they think McGratton and Westgarth all of a sudden would've started attempting to play the game the minute the Sedins came out. "Oh, it's the Sedins... I guess we won't do what our coach put us out here to do anymore and just waste this shift trying to match up skill-wise against them." (translation from cave man).

Great point. Tortorella would instantly lose the respect of his team if he sent their less-able brothers into that situation. I'm pretty sure someone like Bieksa would've stepped up and been like, "uhhh Coach..." That's just how hockey players are with each other.

Tell me this: Can you send your 1st line out and say 'we're here to play hockey.' Especially if you get the refs on red alert. All eyes are then on the Flames to either goon it up or scramble after the face off to get the right matchup on the ice. If they choose goon-mode then you've kinda proven your point, if they choose scramble-mode then crisis averted, or at least you've kicked the can down the road to later in the game.

I see fighting fire with fire, but the Flames had already made their bed.

[swordo84]

Originally Posted by aclark0622

Tell me this: Can you send your 1st line out and say 'we're here to play hockey.' Especially if you get the refs on red alert. All eyes are then on the Flames to either goon it up or scramble after the face off to get the right matchup on the ice. If they choose goon-mode then you've kinda proven your point, if they choose scramble-mode then crisis averted, or at least you've kicked the can down the road to later in the game.

I see fighting fire with fire, but the Flames had already made their bed.

They are going to get jumped (and potentially hurt) regardless of what they tell the refs.

[bonzo48280]

the thought process that the refs can't control the game or wouldn't realize what the Flames are doing is so dumb. If the Canucks put out their top line and 4 guys on Calgary jump them....looks like Vancouver is getting a ton of penalty minutes AND they don't lose 4 guys 2 seconds into the game. This mindset that Torts did the right thing in any stretch of reality is what will always keep hockey as a second rate sport.

"But Bob Hartley PUT OUT HIS GOON LINE"

then score on them and beat them where it matters, on the scoreboard.

[fonzz41]

Originally Posted by aclark0622

Tell me this: Can you send your 1st line out and say 'we're here to play hockey.' Especially if you get the refs on red alert. All eyes are then on the Flames to either goon it up or scramble after the face off to get the right matchup on the ice. If they choose goon-mode then you've kinda proven your point, if they choose scramble-mode then crisis averted, or at least you've kicked the can down the road to later in the game.

I see fighting fire with fire, but the Flames had already made their bed.

Originally Posted by swordo84

They are going to get jumped (and potentially hurt) regardless of what they tell the refs.

This is what I tend to believe from experience. When guys get it into their minds that they are going to do something, it's gonna happen regardless of who is on the ice or what they say. It's just reality. Not saying it's right, but it's reality. Hartley made it clear by starting the game with those guys (as the away team knowing the Canucks would have the chance to match it) that he was ready and willing to go after whoever else came out.

Like I said before, easy for us to take the moral high road as spectators, but so much more has to go on in the minds of the coach. Like you said, aclark, what if they put it off til later? Does McGratton/Westgarth take out a Sedin then? Are they going to let the goons come out and run guys whenever the rest of the game? Or would it be better just to get it done with, get those guys out on their game misconducts, and get on with the game?

Not trying to dictate what should/could've happened, just saying that it's not as easy a situation as some make it out to be, IMO.

[fonzz41]

Originally Posted by bonzo48280

the thought process that the refs can't control the game or wouldn't realize what the Flames are doing is so dumb. If the Canucks put out their top line and 4 guys on Calgary jump them....looks like Vancouver is getting a ton of penalty minutes AND they don't lose 4 guys 2 seconds into the game. This mindset that Torts did the right thing in any stretch of reality is what will always keep hockey as a second rate sport.

"But Bob Hartley PUT OUT HIS GOON LINE"

then score on them and beat them where it matters, on the scoreboard.

Wouldn't that be nice.

[efraser77]

Originally Posted by fonzz41

Hartley obviously was bent on intimidating. When McGratton and Westgarth found out they were starting the game TOGETHER (that's like basically giving the other team a 5-on-3 advantage), Hartley probably didn't even need to tell them what their job was going to be. It's obvious. They were sent out there to set the tone with an intimidating shift. And by intimidating, I mean beat the shit out of people. Speculate how you want, but that's what it was.

I feel for Tortorella in that situation. It's easy for people to say, "send the Sedins out and take advantage of the mismatch," but like I said, Calgary's 4th line knew what their job was for that opening shift, and I guarantee they would do it no matter who was on the ice. They get little enough playing time as is, they are going to do what they're told when they do get to play. Maybe the Sedins wouldn't have fought back, but they still would've gotten roughed up. BUT, if Tortorella elects to send out his 4th line (like he did), he's blamed for helping perpetuate the situation. Tough spot for a coach to be in. We speculate and take the "moral high road" as spectators, but when you're down in the trenches like that, you have some tough calls to make.

Where Torts went wrong was obviously the locker room incident. No place for that and a black eye on the game. Getting press, but for the wrong reasons. I'm totally fine with the suspension, and with Hartley's fine. Torts would've gotten the same fine too if he hadn't mounted an offensive on the Calgary locker room.

I do appreciate the comments he made about Lain in his post-game interview, saying that one of his biggest regrets was putting him in that situation for his first NHL game.

Also, for the record, I'm fine with the NHL being a niche sport too.

Originally Posted by swordo84

You can't send the Sedin line out, you just can't. Henrick was (is) hurt to the point he couldn't finish the game. The Flames line had no intention of playing the puck. Wesgarth didn't even look at it as it was dropped, they would have instantly pounded the crap out of the turtling Swedes.

Torts was in a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

Agree with these. Think Hartley got off too light.

But then again, Westgarth scored last night, so maybe he was looking for that offensive spark...

[aclark0622]

Oh it's not easy at all. Don't get me wrong there's no winner here. I just think Torts comes out of it looking a little better by taking the high road. So the Sedins get roughed up a bit (they could use it). When the dust settles you're looking at a handful of instigating minors on the Flames, I'd throw a bench minor at em, and the story in the media is how to get goonsmanship out of the game, not "Oh wow torts is quite the hothead!"

NHL is heading to the stone age because no one in discipline has the stones to throw the book at the meatheads.

[aclark0622]

I get that you've got protect yourself, Matty, don't get me wrong. Hard to argue against that.

The whole situation brings numerous failures of the system to light.

[fonzz41]

Originally Posted by aclark0622

Oh it's not easy at all. Don't get me wrong there's no winner here. I just think Torts comes out of it looking a little better by taking the high road. So the Sedins get roughed up a bit (they could use it). When the dust settles you're looking at a handful of instigating minors on the Flames, I'd throw a bench minor at em, and the story in the media is how to get goonsmanship out of the game, not "Oh wow torts is quite the hothead!"

NHL is heading to the stone age because no one in discipline has the stones to throw the book at the meatheads.

Originally Posted by aclark0622

I get that you've got protect yourself, Matty, don't get me wrong. Hard to argue against that.

The whole situation brings numerous failures of the system to light.

I can't argue against the appeal of seeing the Sedins getting knocked around a bit!

I totally get where you're coming from, Andy. But another thing to consider and that we've talked about only briefly is Torts's rep with his own team if he lets his stars go out there in what is a perceived disregard of their safety. I guarantee guys like Sestito, Bieksa, Weise, Kassian, etc. would be furious at Torts for putting his stars (and their teammates) in that situation. The hockey player mentality, especially among the more blue-collar players on a roster, is "we know our job and we'll do it for the team". They are the willing bullet-takers sometimes. In this situation, I think they would be more pissed sitting on the bench watching their stars get completely mugged, then they would by being out there themselves.

There are a few holes in this situation, I completely agree. That happens I suppose when so much emotion is involved.

[dmbetc]

Bad mistakes are costing the Kings this game.

[Rebecca De Mornay]

Jackets!!!

God I hate Jeff Carter

[dmbetc]

Columbus looks so good. It is a shame though that they are on such a hot streak (set a club record tonight with 7 consecutive wins) yet they have a lot of empty seats still.

[waterboy100]

finally broke down and bought my stadium series tickets.

cant wait

[waterboy100]

Originally Posted by dmbetc

Bad mistakes are costing the Kings this game.

did they try banking one off the netting, off the goalies back and into the net?

because i hear that works

[dmbetc]

Originally Posted by waterboy100

finally broke down and bought my stadium series tickets.

cant wait

yay! I am so excited for it.

[waterboy100]

Originally Posted by dmbetc

yay! I am so excited for it.

where are you sitting? Top deck here. 'only' $105

[whiteysax]

And the Caps fall another spot in the East... So frustrating to watch such a talented team continue to falter

[Rebecca De Mornay]

Originally Posted by dmbetc

Columbus looks so good. It is a shame though that they are on such a hot streak (set a club record tonight with 7 consecutive wins) yet they have a lot of empty seats still.

Crowd was pretty good tonight actually, it's just that one section in the lower bowl which is easy to see on TV. Upper deck was sold out which is rare for a Tuesday game.

[bradshaw06]

Weird looking night

[dmbetc]

Originally Posted by waterboy100

where are you sitting? Top deck here. 'only' $105

section 127

[dmbetc]

Originally Posted by Rebecca De Mornay

Crowd was pretty good tonight actually, it's just that one section in the lower bowl which is easy to see on TV. Upper deck was sold out which is rare for a Tuesday game.

Gotcha, just seemed bizarre and it was on both sides down the middle of the ice. The sections were practically empty. Obviously not the worst in the league!

[~Crashintome89~]

Originally Posted by waterboy100

where are you sitting? Top deck here. 'only' $105

Believe me when I say you're not paying the ticket to see the game. You're paying to experience an amazing moment in hockey. Yeah, yeah, yeah--the winter classic has been diluted over the years, but to me, that doesn't matter. There is something special about seeing hockey in the outdoors. It adds the tailgating, outside environment of the NFL combined with the wits and intelligence of NHL fans.

[waterboy100]

Originally Posted by ~Crashintome89~

Believe me when I say you're not paying the ticket to see the game. You're paying to experience an amazing moment in hockey. Yeah, yeah, yeah--the winter classic has been diluted over the years, but to me, that doesn't matter. There is something special about seeing hockey in the outdoors. It adds the tailgating, outside environment of the NFL combined with the wits and intelligence of NHL fans.

Oh yeah. I totally get that. It's just that this is approx 8.5x what I normally pay for a game.

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[waterboy100]

Originally Posted by dmbetc

section 127

Is that field?

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[~Crashintome89~]

Originally Posted by waterboy100

Oh yeah. I totally get that. It's just that this is approx 8.5x what I normally pay for a game.

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We've all been there.

I was a poor college student in 2009, and decided to spend 90 bucks for Game 6 tickets for the ECQF against the Pens.

That went well.