Random dmb thoughts that don't need their own thread

[Cptn. Monkeyman]

Originally Posted by OutofDarkness

It's a bit of a grey area for sure, but you could argue that some of the Seek Ups from the late 90s-early '00s went type II.

Yeah towards the end, especially the ones leading into heartbeat intro. Also Carter took a lot of the 90’s Dreaming Trees to a different place towards the end.

Guest spots will sometimes venture a little bit too, like some of the performances with Bela/Flecktones.

[Cptn. Monkeyman]

The intro to Watchtower from LT39 gets pretty nuts with Carter and Greg Howard. Some of the intros to Don’t Drink the Water would go on for a while and had some interesting Dave improv, some would say that’s type 2 territory, but I don’t know. I guess it’s subjective

[JboDaveGuyYNK]

Originally Posted by OutofDarkness

It's a bit of a grey area for sure, but you could argue that some of the Seek Ups from the late 90s-early '00s went type II.

that's funny, Seek Up was first to come to mind and then Blue Water. Didn't mention it in my initial post, I guess I thought I'd get roasted. Per MonkeyMan's comments, Ants/DDTW/Grace didn't really cross my mind. Maybe some 41's throughout the years.

Great username btw

Originally Posted by Cptn. Monkeyman

The type 2 jam is an interesting topic. The key difference in Phish’s jams vs. DMB’s jams is that Phish leans heavily into improvisation, where as DMBs jams remain more structured. Obviously there’s lots of improvising going on with DMB throughout each song (The solos are all improvised, Dave often improvs lyrics, Stefan and Carter play off each other, and Roi used to adlib lines throughout the songs) but the overall structures of the songs themselves aren’t usually improvised, or at least not since the early days.

Check out LT37 from 1992 for some “type 2” improv sections in Two Step and Ants Marching. Also, a lot of the early Blue Water performances would go somewhere else towards the end, usually led by Roi and Carter (3.23.93 comes to mind)

For some more modern performance that seem to push the limits of the song structure would be some versions of Grace is Gone (LT6, LT22) and Ants Marching from LT44.

Thank you for this- I appreciate how you articulated this. That LT22 Grace is such a good point. Could the question of going type 2 be- for someone who was there or listening to it for the first time- what song is this that they are currently playing? (during the jammed out section?)

But then I think, well, could the Sweet LIB from the 2021 tour opener fall into this? But since it was most likely rehearsed, no. But still props to them for switching that up.

How about the 6.26.2011 Seek Up - any "type two-ing" during that intro?

Anyways, don't mind my ramble. It's a fun thing to think about and discuss, especially during the tour break. I'll check out some of the other examples you provided across your posts.

[bryan_fraley]

Guys I messed up. I went to my first Phish show ever at Blossom last night. It did not suck.

[OutofDarkness]

Originally Posted by bryan_fraley

Guys I messed up. I went to my first Phish show ever at Blossom last night. It did not suck.

No kidding, it was a really great show. One of the strongest setlists of the tour IMO.

[Dannyyankou]

So what do we think the free warehouse show will be in 2023? I think the Atlanta show has a good shot.

Note, I'm not picking the show with the best setlist. I'm basically picking the best show without any flubs. One very minor one in Dreaming Tree.

[bowa36]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

So what do we think the free warehouse show will be in 2023? I think the Atlanta show has a good shot.

Note, I'm not picking the show with the best setlist. I'm basically picking the best show without any flubs. One very minor one in Dreaming Tree.

they messed up the 2Step intro and it made me laugh

[btpeters]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

So what do we think the free warehouse show will be in 2023? I think the Atlanta show has a good shot.

Note, I'm not picking the show with the best setlist. I'm basically picking the best show without any flubs. One very minor one in Dreaming Tree.

Bethel has a weird Stay or Leave, but I think that show has a shot. I think Jax N2 could be one too.

All depends on if they allow the new songs to appear on stuff or not.

[Dannyyankou]

Originally Posted by bowa36

they messed up the 2Step intro and it made me laugh

I forgot about that, it reminds me of the Barclays 2012 one lol

Originally Posted by btpeters

Bethel has a weird Stay or Leave, but I think that show has a shot. I think Jax N2 could be one too.

All depends on if they allow the new songs to appear on stuff or not.

That was my first choice, then I heard the Stay Or Leave haha. Dave completely forgot the first verse. It has the best Dreaming Tree of the tour, Buddy does some interesting things on it.

I'd even through Virginia Beach in there. Not the best setlist of the tour, but the tightest performances I think.

Maybe we'll get better choices after the break.

[Dannyyankou]

18 years ago today, this amazing show happened-

http://dmbalmanac.com/TourShowSet.as...=80&where=2004

[TheStone91]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

18 years ago today, this amazing show happened-

http://dmbalmanac.com/TourShowSet.as...=80&where=2004

It might be better than Alpine N1 two days later (aka LT 8)…and Andy Roddick was there! lol

[Dannyyankou]

Rapunzel sounds amazing this year. Buddy has fully embraced the piano sound-

https://youtu.be/zFEqujKUgKY

[Afoolsmistake]

Do people buy/sell 1st year warehouse accounts?

[8nalive]

Happy Birthday Jeff Coffin!

[Speilmen230]

Re-listening to Grace from Blossom this year, Xcacel's rip. The jam with Buddy is really really good, but I still sorely miss the sax on this song. See LT 26 for what I mean.

[spoot388]

Originally Posted by JboDaveGuyYNK

Has DMB ever gone type ll jam?

Been listening to more Phish here and there before revving back up to DMB closer to the Gorge. The type II concept is intriguing to me and would love to hear if there's ever been any instance(s), to anyone's knowledge.

i'm not a musical person, but would #41 from LT22 be type 2? jeff and carter play off each other and jeff's solo takes on a weird feel from carter.

Originally Posted by hurley711

I don't know where to post this so I'll ry here first since it's random and a thought.

What are some songs that have changed into better versions a far as the way that the band plays them? An example I immediately think of is #41. Dave's early version was basically playing the high strings on his guitar underneath the band on the album but it quickly grew into him playing lush full chords with bass notes leading into the chords. LLC is a great example of how early he changed how he played the song. Curious to other examples of changes like that which were for the better. I hope that make sense.

YMDT absolutely sucked in 2005. it had nothing to it, just completely flat. today its a powerhouse

[Cptn. Monkeyman]

Originally Posted by spoot388

i'm not a musical person, but would #41 from LT22 be type 2? jeff and carter play off each other and jeff's solo takes on a weird feel from carter.

Yeah I’d say it went there. LT22 had so many jams, it’s an underrated release. Not sure how you feel about Lying in the Hands of God, but I believe the best performance of that song happened on LT22. Once again, Jeff took it to another level.

[crounsa810]

Originally Posted by Cptn. Monkeyman

Yeah I’d say it went there. LT22 had so many jams, it’s an underrated release. Not sure how you feel about Lying in the Hands of God, but I believe the best performance of that song happened on LT22. Once again, Jeff took it to another level.

It’s close, but the best version is 9/18/2011

[YankeesDMB41]

Originally Posted by crounsa810

It’s close, but the best version is 9/18/2011

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRh44596MPY

This is one of my favorite DMB jams ever.

[Springraces]

Originally Posted by Dannyyankou

Rapunzel sounds amazing this year. Buddy has fully embraced the piano sound-

https://youtu.be/zFEqujKUgKY

Yep! It's got that late 90's vibe back!! Jazzy and slowed down a bit compared to the last decade plus.

[Springraces]

Originally Posted by KevinTH

I’ve always felt 2002 deserves that title. It’s not represented well through live releases, and people don’t really talk about it much here.

The band sounded tighter than ever, the Everyday songs took on DMB’s classic sound which ultimately kept the catalog strong, Busted Stuff was a great release that summer which prompted them to start playing songs like Kit Kat Jam and Captain and gave us You Never Know, Boyd sounded good, the sets were flawless from the start of the spring tour to the end of the fall tour (minus the infamous 4/5/02 encore), and yet somehow this tour continues to fly under the radar of tours like 2000 and 2004.

I would agree with you. 2002 is very under-represented likely due to the Gorge box set release. They've probably felt it was well represented based on that. But now having LT 40 with it.

2006 was kinda sleepy for me. I remember thinking the band had gotten a bit stale and only went to one night of a 2 night stand for the first time. Of course regretted now going to both as Last Stop got played the night I didn't go!

Knowing what I know now it makes sense as the band was on the verge of breaking up that entire year. Still had some great shows. Would love a Gorge release of that tour.

I'd love a spring 02 specifically.

[JboDaveGuyYNK]

Originally Posted by spoot388

i'm not a musical person, but would #41 from LT22 be type 2? jeff and carter play off each other and jeff's solo takes on a weird feel from carter

GREAT call, what a rip. Love that version and listened again today. The only downfall of that one is that I kept waiting for the "I belieevveee...." (outro from 4/20/02) to hit. But yea I think you're on to something there.

[8nalive]

Originally Posted by YankeesDMB41

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRh44596MPY

This is one of my favorite DMB jams ever.

That was a high energy jam!

[Dannyyankou]

I have to say, it isn't the best set in the world, but Virginia Beach from this tour is an enjoyable listen. It might be the best Dave's voice sounded in several years. He even sounds decent on Sledgehammer.

[Cptn. Monkeyman]

Originally Posted by crounsa810

It’s close, but the best version is 9/18/2011

Another great version. Can’t go wrong with either one

[OutofDarkness]

Originally Posted by hurley711

I don't know where to post this so I'll ry here first since it's random and a thought.

What are some songs that have changed into better versions a far as the way that the band plays them? An example I immediately think of is #41. Dave's early version was basically playing the high strings on his guitar underneath the band on the album but it quickly grew into him playing lush full chords with bass notes leading into the chords. LLC is a great example of how early he changed how he played the song. Curious to other examples of changes like that which were for the better. I hope that make sense.

YMDT and So Right are the obvious examples. The Stone didn't get better post-Roi, but it changed drastically and stayed great. Two Step went full minor key post-Crash. Typical Situation is an interesting one: the jam used to be much faster and more upbeat. Then they slowed it down, made it more somber, and added the 6/8 jam. Ultimately, the song was better for it. The original versions were a little too peppy given the lyrics and general feel of the song. That said, there is something about those early Typicals I really enjoy.

[ToySoldier#34]

Originally Posted by hurley711

I don't know where to post this so I'll ry here first since it's random and a thought.

What are some songs that have changed into better versions a far as the way that the band plays them? An example I immediately think of is #41. Dave's early version was basically playing the high strings on his guitar underneath the band on the album but it quickly grew into him playing lush full chords with bass notes leading into the chords. LLC is a great example of how early he changed how he played the song. Curious to other examples of changes like that which were for the better. I hope that make sense.

#41 is great obviously but I did love the guitar part on 41 Police

[spoot388]

Originally Posted by Cptn. Monkeyman

Yeah I’d say it went there. LT22 had so many jams, it’s an underrated release. Not sure how you feel about Lying in the Hands of God, but I believe the best performance of that song happened on LT22. Once again, Jeff took it to another level.

i'm not a huge fan of LITHOG, mostly because it getting played typically means a song like LIOG or Crush wont be. with that said, i was present for both LT22 and the randall's caravan. i'd put randall's at #1, but LT22 is probably still top 3.

side story, i was on the rail in front of jeff for LT22. i was jammin out to it when his solo started to pick up, and i'm pretty sure that dave was watching me. i looked at him and didn't break my stare, and it didn't seem like he did either. during this time, dave starts strumming harder and plays a higher chord, and i can pick up on it when listening to the recording. its at 9:56.


personally, i think LT22 has the best performance of a bunch of songs, at least in the DMB3.0 era. Warehouse, Seven, YMDT. hell, the entire first disc of the release is about as flawless as it gets. that show was bonkers. 1 song over 20 minutes, 2 more over 15, 4 more over 10 with warehouse essentially a 5th at 9:37. they played like 2 hours of jam songs in one show. i dont think i've ever seen another set with that many long songs.

[hopewelljones]

https://youtu.be/KDO69nBbdB8

Gets me every time

[bigeyedpigs]

I really think bef flows better with tlws lyrics. Just think if if it was sung live...a fishes dreams should stay in the fucking sea...would really tie it in.
Either way, the song is great