The NHL Thread - Page 961 - Antsmarching.org Forums
Old 06-25-2015, 12:44 PM   #28801
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Re: The NHL Thread

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Originally Posted by aeroshady View Post
100% against expansion. I hate the idea of it on every level. If you are going to expand, I want the Cap removed and if we ever get past 32 teams for a promotion/relegation system to take over with our minor leagues.

Would never happen, but those are my feelings on it.

Realistically, the NHL should drop down to 26 teams. Lose Florida, Arizona, Dallas, and Carolina.
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  • Old 06-25-2015, 01:21 PM   #28802
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    As for expansion, bring back the Hartford Whalers!!!
    Agreed!

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    Originally Posted by salrx95 View Post
    I am with H2P. I would prefer no expansion. Buildings are empty now and talent will be further diluted. This will make it harder for teams to rebuild which leads to bigger contracts for fringe players to bring players to lower franchises. Look how long the Islanders took to rebuild and how empty our building was and we have a small yet loyal fanbase. I wanted them to spend too but looking back maybe they got it right because how much young cheap talent we have and they then were able to resign their key veterans to big deals and are in great cap shape, especially with a new JT coming before you know it.

    You look at situations around the league like Florida and how bleak the fans, situation and outlook is. I am not convinced Vegas works. It could be a novelty act that grows tired quick if the team's success is like Columbus (no offense). I think Quebec work well. A new Canada team or another Toronto team would work better.
    Very well stated.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 02:01 PM   #28803
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    100% against expansion. I hate the idea of it on every level. If you are going to expand, I want the Cap removed and if we ever get past 32 teams for a promotion/relegation system to take over with our minor leagues.

    Would never happen, but those are my feelings on it.

    Realistically, the NHL should drop down to 26 teams. Lose Florida, Arizona, Dallas, and Carolina.
    Might have it backwards with how that should work. Cap needs to go away if they were to contract. Teams would be tough to afford all the influx of talent and salary.

    I used to feel they needed to contract, but not anymore. I don't think expansion should happen (although it's gonna) but I think 30 works because I think we have markets that should have teams and contracting doesn't get you there. Yotes to the Northwest and Panthers to Quebec. Dallas is actually a pretty good market so I think they should stay. For a non-playoff team they had pretty good attendance this year and they were a very good market when they contending every year. Canes are struggling but you aren't gonna contract one team so either they stay or you move them somewhere out West. 15/15 split that way too.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 02:33 PM   #28804
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    Please do not mention contraction with a straight face. It's not even worth having that argument. NHL league revenues are way up, popularity is as high as it has been in a long time. Etc. etc. it's just pointless to outline the reasons why that is a ludicrous idea.

    Expansion may not be a great idea for a variety of reasons, but diluation of talent is not one of them. The talent pool is enormous, and it's only getting larger. Realistically, the level of play in the NHL is as high as it has ever been and it is only growing, not to mention the NHL would do well to attract more players from the Euro leagues and KHL in order to maintain the NHL as the best league in the world.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 02:46 PM   #28805
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    Originally Posted by Bron Yr Aur View Post
    Please do not mention contraction with a straight face. It's not even worth having that argument. NHL league revenues are way up, popularity is as high as it has been in a long time. Etc. etc. it's just pointless to outline the reasons why that is a ludicrous idea.

    Expansion may not be a great idea for a variety of reasons, but diluation of talent is not one of them. The talent pool is enormous, and it's only getting larger. Realistically, the level of play in the NHL is as high as it has ever been and it is only growing, not to mention the NHL would do well to attract more players from the Euro leagues and KHL in order to maintain the NHL as the best league in the world.
    Differences opinions do not make the idea ludicrous. Fact is, the Florida Panthers attendance is pathetic. Carolina, Arizona and other teams have also been sad at times when the product on the ice has been lacking.

    I don't know how anyone could look at Florida and say it has been a success in any way. (And that is coming from a person who's original favorite team was the Panthers). I personally own 4 Panthers jerseys....that is more than they have probably sold over the last 5 years.

    Point being, each team would be stronger in talent with less teams there. I agree with what was said earlier. Maybe you have a hard time seeing that because Chicago shits gold right now. 3 cups would make me think the NHL was perfect the way it is too.
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    This might be one of the single greatest solo posting performances in NHL Thread history. Well done, Greg, and congrats on the win. Was a fun game.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 02:56 PM   #28806
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    Mike Green 100% for sure headed to free agency. Confirmed by his agent today. Eric Fehr will leave the Caps as well.

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    Old 06-25-2015, 02:58 PM   #28807
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    Originally Posted by Bron Yr Aur View Post
    Please do not mention contraction with a straight face. It's not even worth having that argument. NHL league revenues are way up, popularity is as high as it has been in a long time. Etc. etc. it's just pointless to outline the reasons why that is a ludicrous idea.

    Expansion may not be a great idea for a variety of reasons, but diluation of talent is not one of them. The talent pool is enormous, and it's only getting larger. Realistically, the level of play in the NHL is as high as it has ever been and it is only growing, not to mention the NHL would do well to attract more players from the Euro leagues and KHL in order to maintain the NHL as the best league in the world.
    the bolded is just not true
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:03 PM   #28808
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    Differences opinions do not make the idea ludicrous. Fact is, the Florida Panthers attendance is pathetic. Carolina, Arizona and other teams have also been sad at times when the product on the ice has been lacking.

    I don't know how anyone could look at Florida and say it has been a success in any way. (And that is coming from a person who's original favorite team was the Panthers). I personally own 4 Panthers jerseys....that is more than they have probably sold over the last 5 years.

    Point being, each team would be stronger in talent with less teams there. I agree with what was said earlier. Maybe you have a hard time seeing that because Chicago shits gold right now. 3 cups would make me think the NHL was perfect the way it is too.
    I think his point is the NHL won't do it. I understand where you are coming from, and I was on board with that for a while. But contraction would hurt revenue because relocation would be the answer to fix the trouble ones. Seattle, Portland, Kansas City, Milwaukee, Quebec to name the ones we know. I agree Glendale sucks and FLA might be too far removed from it's good year to recover but there are places they could go. On top of that, the NHLPA would never allow it. While it would bring more talent to more teams, it would cost them (4 teams gone) almost 200 jobs.
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    I am so jealous of the coyotes right now.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:05 PM   #28809
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    the bolded is just not true
    Actually I think it's higher than it's ever been since we've had 30 teams. Maybe more talent was out there when we had fewer teams but since 200-01? I think we're up there and getting guys like Eichel and McDavid into it now. Overall the NHL is probably the healthiest it's ever been. BUT we do still have some troubled franchises and I think they should address FLA and AZ by moving them first but I think they feel they'll improve where they are. FLA maybe cause they seem to have a plan now. AZ? I don't think that shit is ever getting right.
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    I am so jealous of the coyotes right now.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:06 PM   #28810
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    Mike Green 100% for sure headed to free agency. Confirmed by his agent today. Eric Fehr will leave the Caps as well.

    http://www.csnwashington.com/hockey-...ir-future-caps
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    I am so jealous of the coyotes right now.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:18 PM   #28811
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    Differences opinions do not make the idea ludicrous. Fact is, the Florida Panthers attendance is pathetic. Carolina, Arizona and other teams have also been sad at times when the product on the ice has been lacking.

    I don't know how anyone could look at Florida and say it has been a success in any way. (And that is coming from a person who's original favorite team was the Panthers). I personally own 4 Panthers jerseys....that is more than they have probably sold over the last 5 years.

    Point being, each team would be stronger in talent with less teams there. I agree with what was said earlier. Maybe you have a hard time seeing that because Chicago shits gold right now. 3 cups would make me think the NHL was perfect the way it is too.
    That's not why it's ludicrous.

    It's ludicrous because:

    1. NHL revenues are growing. The NHL is basically a collection of businesses. Nobody contracts their business when the corporation is making more money than ever. OK, maybe you could move some franchises from areas where attendance is poor, but that isn't a viable argument for contraction.

    2. You think the players union would ever accept any idea that cuts down on NHL player jobs? Give me a break. OK, if they had to do so to keep the NHL up and running, but as we know, the NHL is doing just fine.

    So yes, without acknowledging the obvious reasons that contraction is ridiculous, it is hard to take you seriously.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:20 PM   #28812
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    If there's any team that I would stress just a little more patience for, it's Florida. Yeah, I know "patience" is tough when they've had no success over their 20-whatever year history, but there's a lot of reason there right now to be excited. They've got really good pieces at every position and are A LOT of fun to watch. Let these guys grow, play, and start to win, and I think people in Florida will get excited. Give it a couple more years in Florida, says I. I don't remember ever seeing the potential for great things in Florida like we're seeing right now.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:22 PM   #28813
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    the bolded is just not true
    I'm sorry that you are so completely wrong once again.

    There are more people playing hockey than ever. The pool of people who play hockey and from which NHL players are chosen from is as large as it has ever been and is only going to continue to grow. The competition just to crack the NHL is the greatest it has ever been for obvious reasons (population growth, kids starting at earlier ages, better training and coaching for youth players, etc.).

    The idea that the product is "diminished" from some imaginary level that it once was on the basis of diluted talent is incorrect.

    Now, the argument that the league needs to implement a more fluid game, allow less interference, institute rules for more goal scoring, etc....that is a different argument altogether and has nothing to do with expansion.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:23 PM   #28814
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    theres a difference between the league being flush with talent and being top heavy with talent

    right now, its top heavy
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:26 PM   #28815
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    If there's any team that I would stress just a little more patience for, it's Florida. Yeah, I know "patience" is tough when they've had no success over their 20-whatever year history, but there's a lot of reason there right now to be excited. They've got really good pieces at every position and are A LOT of fun to watch. Let these guys grow, play, and start to win, and I think people in Florida will get excited. Give it a couple more years in Florida, says I. I don't remember ever seeing the potential for great things in Florida like we're seeing right now.
    They had success that one year. lol Who did they play in the Finals..... hmmmm? I think they can be successful too with time.
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    I am so jealous of the coyotes right now.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:26 PM   #28816
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    theres a difference between the league being flush with talent and being top heavy with talent

    right now, its top heavy
    You can't be expected to be taken seriously if you just throw out blanket statements without even attempting to provide some basis for them.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:32 PM   #28817
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    They had success that one year. lol Who did they play in the Finals..... hmmmm? I think they can be successful too with time.
    Oh yeah.

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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:33 PM   #28818
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    You can't be expected to be taken seriously if you just throw out blanket statements without even attempting to provide some basis for them.
    you can backread if you want, not gonna type out points already made

    and its not a blanket statement. its just a statement. the top tier talent is very good right now, but after those dozen or 2 players there's a huge drop off
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    Old 06-25-2015, 03:34 PM   #28819
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    Old 06-25-2015, 04:00 PM   #28820
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    That's not why it's ludicrous.

    It's ludicrous because:

    1. NHL revenues are growing. The NHL is basically a collection of businesses. Nobody contracts their business when the corporation is making more money than ever. OK, maybe you could move some franchises from areas where attendance is poor, but that isn't a viable argument for contraction.

    2. You think the players union would ever accept any idea that cuts down on NHL player jobs? Give me a break. OK, if they had to do so to keep the NHL up and running, but as we know, the NHL is doing just fine.

    So yes, without acknowledging the obvious reasons that contraction is ridiculous, it is hard to take you seriously.
    First, I clearly stated that it was never going to happen. So I am not really sure what you are arguing for. I was stating what I would realistically like to see happen, not what I think will happen.

    Second, the league is always in dangers of several teams operating at a loss. Arizona, Florida and Carolina come to mind. In the not too distant past Pittsburgh and Buffalo were in some trouble too.

    Hell, I even remember there being talk about New Jersey needing to be moved before they won the cup in 1995. Okay so this is a long time ago...but still, bad markets are in danger unless they have success to back them up.

    My reasoning is that most teams right now do have their 3-4 big players and then a lot of fill-in players. It is not like watching soccer where you can have amazing teams from top-bottom like Barca, Real or Bayern. The closest I have seen to that recently was the 2002 Red Wings who were amazing pretty much from top-bottom.

    I mean, Michael Roszival (Sp?) was a disaster on the New York Rangers and we moved him. He is a stanley cup champion on the Hawks. Is it really that he just fit in better there? Or is it maybe just a reality that there are shitty players on every team in the league, cup champs or not.

    In the end, the league is not exactly shit the way it is either. Been a pretty good product on the ice over the past 4-5 years. Just wondering if it could be better. I am also biased because I am willing to try anything that may change the tides so the Rangers win a Cup every 10-20 years instead of every 54.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 04:29 PM   #28821
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    I am still trying to figure out what retard thought vegas was the best city for an expansion team. What a absolutely stupid idea. They will never fill that arena, hell the only way people will even attend games is if fans of other teams take a trip to the casino's when their favorite team is in town or the casino's will be handing out free tickets to gamblers. What a god damned stupid choice....
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    Old 06-25-2015, 04:46 PM   #28822
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    I am still trying to figure out what retard thought vegas was the best city for an expansion team. What a absolutely stupid idea. They will never fill that arena, hell the only way people will even attend games is if fans of other teams take a trip to the casino's when their favorite team is in town or the casino's will be handing out free tickets to gamblers. What a god damned stupid choice....
    It's a pretty simple marketing strategy. The idea is to grow the NHL brand, and expand. By just sticking to your traditional markets where you know hockey will succeed, the brand stays stagnant. Bettman is hell bent on expanding the NHL brand, and hockey in general, which I actually like quite a bit.

    Hockey is pretty over-saturated in the NE, midwest, and Canada. We already have enough teams in those locations, MORE than enough. We have our SE teams, Texas, Arizona, and California. Where else?

    Vegas works as an experiment. People always associate it with the bright lights and casinos, but there actually is a pretty good metro area outside that not even close to being associated with that stuff. I have a friend that has a brother that lives in Vegas, and he's beyond pumped to be getting a NHL team, probably will get season tickets.

    In addition, tourists can come in and it can become a "thing" to do there, and expose people to hockey that may not have before.

    I'm totally cool with Vegas as a team. It helps that I love that Arizona and Dallas have teams too, though. I like the idea of expanding hockey.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 05:48 PM   #28823
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    So the Avs just acquired Carl Soderberg... Weird.

    Not complaining, love the talent. Just not what I was expecting.

    Of course, this is all dependent on if they can sign him.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 05:51 PM   #28824
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    I am still trying to figure out what retard thought vegas was the best city for an expansion team. What a absolutely stupid idea. They will never fill that arena, hell the only way people will even attend games is if fans of other teams take a trip to the casino's when their favorite team is in town or the casino's will be handing out free tickets to gamblers. What a god damned stupid choice....
    While I'm hesitant about it working long term, they are doing their due diligence here. They've got over 13k season tickets sold. And that's to everyday local fans and multi-year commitments. They still have the casinos and other sponsors to sell tickets to. That's not too shabby. Could it fail in the long run? Yes but there is for sure interest there. Chris is right, going to markets like this brings in new money with new sponsors. I also read an article that pointed out, by doing this, it still leaves places like Southern Ontario to fall back on if this fails badly. If this works? You've just made the league a crap ton of money.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 05:53 PM   #28825
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    Re: The NHL Thread

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    So the Avs just acquired Carl Soderberg... Weird.

    Not complaining, love the talent. Just not what I was expecting.

    Of course, this is all dependent on if they can sign him.
    Yeah, you think he signs? I'd think going to UFA would be better for him.
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    Originally Posted by fonzz41 View Post
    I am so jealous of the coyotes right now.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 05:54 PM   #28826
    fonzz41
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    One thing I am sure of... this is probably the beginning of a ROR trade.

    Big, left-handed shooting center who's defensively responsible? Check.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 05:56 PM   #28827
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TMoore4075 View Post
    Yeah, you think he signs? I'd think going to UFA would be better for him.
    No clue. But yeah, you'd think he'd want to test waters.

    More than anything, I think this is just the Avs trying to have a backup plan already in place for what they're perhaps seeing as the inevitable departure of ROR.
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    Old 06-25-2015, 06:03 PM   #28828
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    So my nephew is dumb and is a fan of the Avs. Will be watching them lose to the Flyers in November
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    Old 06-25-2015, 09:43 PM   #28829
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JRS1386 View Post
    So my nephew is dumb and is a fan of the Avs. Will be watching them lose to the Flyers in November
    is he mormon?
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    Old 06-25-2015, 09:56 PM   #28830
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    Re: The NHL Thread

    No just a moron
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