*Prompter Thread* (NO personal attacks, NO trolling)

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by daveshookme

Because you seem to think that somebody working FT would need a different minimum wage from somebody working PT for the FT person to earn a livable wage.

But keep thinking and get back to me why you think that is.

I think you have me confused with Babs. You're really bad at reading.

[Antiramie]

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

I was just going for a thought experiment. Lee asked if “all jobs should pay a livable wage”. I said “all full time jobs should”. He said “so you’d support a higher min wage for full time?”, and I said “sure” and added that it could be higher than $15. Purely hypothetical.

The incentive in this hypothetical is wage growth - any upward pressure on lower bound wages has positive externalities across the wage spectrum. Wage growth is basically non-existent right now, despite massive gains in productivity, profitability, and overall economic growth. It’s not out of the realm of possibility to say that at this point maybe the best way for wage growth is through government action/regulation. The free market sure as hell isn’t doing it.

But an immediate boost in the lower bounds of wages will naturally increase the wages of jobs that are inherently more stable...at least in theory.

Not to mention only like 0.5% of all current workers are full time on minimum wage. So, unless you expect that share to drastically increase if/when minimum wage goes up, it seems unnecessary to mandate a separate minimum wage for such a small proportion of people.

It seems like the easier solution (for all wage ranges) would be just mandate that minimum wage must keep up with inflation, rather than try to compartmentalize legislation into an ever-changing labor environment.

[BTBaboon]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

I think you have me confused with Babs. You're really bad at reading.

No - you were the origin of it. I said that full time workers should be paid a livable wages - that’s the lowest I’m personally willing to set the bar. It is disgusting that someone can work 40 hours a week and not get by.

You then replied with the suggestion of a different wage for FT - I said sure to go along with the thought experiment.

[Useliteski]

any system that that neglects the majority of people, or all of the environment, is a system we should ditch, right now.

[BTBaboon]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

So you'd support making a higher minimum wage for full time employment?

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

Sure - so long as there’s safeguards against companies taking wage workers who consistently are at 40 hours or more and pushing them below full time to avoid wage increases.

It can be higher than $15 for this group! I like the idea, Lee!

In case we forgot where we started

[daveshookme]

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

In case we forgot where we started

learn to read! He didn't say that! You're missing everything!

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

In case we forgot where we started

Exactly - where does it say I support anything?

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

No - you were the origin of it. I said that full time workers should be paid a livable wages - that’s the lowest I’m personally willing to set the bar. It is disgusting that someone can work 40 hours a week and not get by.

You then replied with the suggestion of a different wage for FT - I said sure to go along with the thought experiment.

You're not quite as bad as reading as Shook, but still pretty bad.

I asked a question - I didn't take a position at all. Here's the complete exchange:

Originally Posted by Lee3691

I probably know the answer to this - and I am sure most people in this thread would agree with you - but should every job pay a "livable" wage?

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

Every full time job, yes.

Originally Posted by Lee3691

So you'd support making a higher minimum wage for full time employment?

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

Sure - so long as there’s safeguards against companies taking wage workers who consistently are at 40 hours or more and pushing them below full time to avoid wage increases.

It can be higher than $15 for this group! I like the idea, Lee!

[daveshookme]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

Exactly - where does it say I support anything?



You're not quite as bad as reading as Shook, but still pretty bad.

I asked a question - I didn't take a position at all. Here's the complete exchange:

It would appear you suggested it, right? Like, that's a word you would use to describe your question? So, I ask again since you're so fucking jumping at the bit creaming your pants at this for some reason:

Originally Posted by daveshookme

Why does mandating that a FT job pay a livable wage inherently mean, or even suggest, that it would require a different minimum wage from a PT job?

[daveshookme]

Like, you proposed it; out of godawful fuckass nowhere. I said that's not what he said, nor is that what it means. Mathematically. And then bam. You just fucking ran with it like the troll you are.

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by daveshookme

It would appear you suggested it, right? Like, that's a word you would use to describe your question? So, I ask again since you're so fucking jumping at the bit creaming your pants at this for some reason:

Maybe it's an upstate NY thing, but for the rest of us asking a question....is just asking a question. Nothing suggested at all.

To answer your question: Nothing. Nobody brought up that point until you got a little chubby and started asking about something that nobody was talking about. This thread does thank you for your valuable point that working less hours means making less money though.

[daveshookme]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

Maybe it's an upstate NY thing, but for the rest of us asking a question....is just asking a question. Nothing suggested at all.

To answer your question: Nothing. Nobody brought up that point until you got a little chubby and started asking about something that nobody was talking about. This thread does thank you for your valuable point that working less hours means making less money though.

You were talking about it! God you're fucking dull. I asked you why you'd even propose that, as it's totally and wholly irrelevant.

But that's your thing.

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by daveshookme

Like, you proposed it; out of godawful fuckass nowhere. I said that's not what he said, nor is that what it means. Mathematically. And then bam. You just fucking ran with it like the troll you are.

You're really bad at reading - needed to be said again, as nobody suggested anything, beyond when Babs said: "Every full time job, yes". That's when the differential between FT and PT employment was even brought up. And Babs even further explained, he does support a higher minimum wage for FT employment.

[daveshookme]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

You're really bad at reading - needed to be said again, as nobody suggested anything, beyond when Babs said: "Every full time job, yes". That's when the differential between FT and PT employment was even brought up. And Babs even further explained, he does support a higher minimum wage for FT employment.

We're not doing this all night, one way or the other. Answer the question "why would you think FT employees would need a different minimum wage than PT employees?" or you're just gonna be talking to your wall for a few days.

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by daveshookme

You were talking about it! God you're fucking dull. I asked you why you'd even propose that, as it's totally and wholly irrelevant.

But that's your thing.

I'm very sorry that me asking a question has triggered you so much. Still suggest you read what people actually write instead of what you pretend it says though.

[coldengrey12]

Wow, the left is tearing itself apart in here today jk

[Antiramie]

Unless you can guarantee that every worker in this country is able to get full time hours, a livable wage should only be $X per hour x maximum weekly/monthly hours x 52 weeks/12 months, which is equal to or greater than the lowest yearly livable wage.

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by daveshookme

We're not doing this all night, one way or the other. Answer the question "why would you think FT employees would need a different minimum wage than PT employees?" or you're just gonna be talking to your wall for a few days.

What a fragile ego you must have. I'll answer your irrelevant question, but you should still ban me if it'll make you feel better with all of this anger you have. I don't think the minimum wage should be different based on hours worked (as if you couldn't tell that from my responses back and forth to Babs). Babs does, however. Maybe he can go into further detail why he thinks this is a good idea (which it isn't, it's a terrible idea, as I explained, as it'll cause employers to cut hours for full times employees and not hire any more full time employees).

[daveshookme]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

What a fragile ego you must have. I'll answer your irrelevant question, but you should still ban me if it'll make you feel better with all of this anger you have. I don't think the minimum wage should be different based on hours worked (as if you couldn't tell that from my responses back and forth to Babs). Babs does, however. Maybe he can go into further detail why he thinks this is a good idea (which it isn't, it's a terrible idea, as I explained, as it'll cause employers to cut hours for full times employees and not hire any more full time employees).

ok now why would you interpret "FT employees should be paid livable wages" to mean "PT/FT employees should have a different minimum wage"

[BTBaboon]

“I was just asking questions!”

My “sure” was to follow along with the thought experiment. It’s totally unnecessary to differentiate, but you asked for a qualifier for “liveable” and then followed up asking about separate mins - which I also clarified *if* you wanted to do that, you’d want safeguards and for it to be higher than the base minimum wage.

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by daveshookme

ok now why would you interpret "FT employees should be paid livable wages" to mean "PT/FT employees should have a different minimum wage"

See below:

Originally Posted by Lee3691

I probably know the answer to this - and I am sure most people in this thread would agree with you - but should every job pay a "livable" wage?

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

Every full time job, yes.

Originally Posted by Lee3691

So you'd support making a higher minimum wage for full time employment?

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

Sure - so long as there’s safeguards against companies taking wage workers who consistently are at 40 hours or more and pushing them below full time to avoid wage increases.

It can be higher than $15 for this group! I like the idea, Lee!

I've highlighted the appropriate areas to help here.

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

“I was just asking questions!”

My “sure” was to follow along with the thought experiment. It’s totally unnecessary to differentiate, but you asked for a qualifier for “liveable” and then followed up asking about separate mins - which I also clarified *if* you wanted to do that, you’d want safeguards and for it to be higher than the base minimum wage.

Then why did you differentiate it?

[BTBaboon]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

What a fragile ego you must have.

Who shit in your cereal today?

Originally Posted by Lee3691

Babs does, however.

I do not, I was just following along with the hypothetical you proposed. All my replies were under the premise you presented.

I support a $15/hr min wage, for all workers, period, end of story. You came in with weird qualifiers to challenge a “livable wage” and I went with you for the ride on what that would have to look like.

Maybe you just misunderstood? If so, I apologize for that. But I wasn’t the one who brought it up, so...

[Antiramie]

What's the point in specifying that full time hourly employees should make a minimum wage unless:

A. You're implicitly including part time employees that work multiple jobs

B. You don't think part time workers deserve a livable wage

shook, I don't know why you're pressing Lee instead of BTB. It's an odd line to draw considering full time hourly employees make up 0.5% of the workforce.

[BTBaboon]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

Then why did you differentiate it?

When I said “every full time job, yes”? Because I don’t think anyone working full time should not be able to make ends meet.

That’s not saying people working less than full time shouldn’t get a $15/hr wage (part time workers will never earn a “living wage” at less than full time, and Shook noted that with his very basic good math) or that there should be a differentiator. That came from your following post - you asked.

[daveshookme]

Originally Posted by Antiramie

What's the point in specifying that full time hourly employees should make a minimum wage unless:

A. You're grouping in part time employees that work multiple jobs

B. You don't think part time workers deserve a livable wage

shook, I don't know why you're pressing Lee instead of BTB. It's an odd line to draw considering full time hourly employees make up 0.5% of the workforce.

Because BTB doesn't believe that and because Lee just came up with "bahhhh you mean they have to have a different minimum wage?!?!!!???" out of absolutely cosmic nothingness.

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

Who shit in your cereal today?

While you might not have liked my responses, I think that question might be directed at the person whose first contribution to this topic was trying to insult my math skills, then shared the valuable insight that working less hours means making less money, and then threatened to ban me if I didn't answer a question that I clearly expressed my view on. Maybe it's me though?

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

I do not, I was just following along with the hypothetical you proposed. All my replies were under the premise you presented.

I support a $15/hr min wage, for all workers, period, end of story. You came in with weird qualifiers to challenge a “livable wage” and I went with you for the ride on what that would have to look like.

Maybe you just misunderstood? If so, I apologize for that. But I wasn’t the one who brought it up, so...

Obviously there was miscommunication here, but when I asked the question about a livable wage - which was only asked in a straightforward way, your answer wasn't yes.....it was answered with the qualifier of full time employment. I was curious to the logic behind this, so I asked, and you shared why you thought that. All good though. Even though you're wrong about a higher minimum wage for full time employees not causing a reduction in those jobs though.

[Antiramie]

I'm team Lee here. He asked if EVERY job should get a livable wage. And BTB responded with EVERY FULL TIME JOB not EVERY JOB, INCLUDING FULL TIME ONES.

By adding a qualifier, it came across like he was implying part time workers don't deserve a livable wage ie a different wage.

[DMBstandUP1984]

Decided to eat a banana. Bad idea

[Climb2safety]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

Maybe it's an upstate NY thing, but for the rest of us asking a question....is just asking a question. Nothing suggested at all.

To answer your question: Nothing. Nobody brought up that point until you got a little chubby and started asking about something that nobody was talking about. This thread does thank you for your valuable point that working less hours means making less money though.

I did this once and it became a 5 year meme

[BTBaboon]

Originally Posted by Antiramie

I'm team Lee here. He asked if EVERY job should get a livable wage. And BTB responded with EVERY FULL TIME JOB not EVERY JOB INCLUDING FULL TIME ONES.

Can a part time worker ever have a livable wage?

I think that’s the distinction here - and maybe it got lost in the hypothetical. Lee wasn’t asking “what jobs should earn a $15/hr wage”; or that’s not how I took his question. The answer to *that* question is “all jobs”.