It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit - Antsmarching.org Forums - Dave Matthews Band Discussion

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View Poll Results: Rate Buddy 1-5 based on his first four show
Great addition, looking forward to more! 67 36.02%
Good, but could do more/less. 51 27.42%
Indifferent/don’t really notice or care. 7 3.76%
Some moments of greatness, but overall I could do without. 18 9.68%
Where’s a violin/Butch? 43 23.12%
Voters: 186. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-03-2019, 02:43 PM   #1
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It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

watsonbriant made a thread in May of last year (see below).
https://www.antsmarching.org/forum/s...d.php?t=347477

We've all had time now to let it sink in and see how Buddy fits into the band so I thought we could revisit this poll.

Has your decision changed? If so, why?

I voted 5 last year but I'm at a 1 now.

Using the same poll options as the other thread.
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  • Old 05-03-2019, 02:44 PM   #2
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    organ on LIOG
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    Old 05-03-2019, 02:53 PM   #3
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Bmwm3oz View Post
    watsonbriant made a thread in May of last year (see below).

    https://www.antsmarching.org/forum/s...d.php?t=347477



    We've all had time now to let it sink in and see how Buddy fits into the band so I thought we could revisit this poll.



    Has your decision changed? If so, why?



    I voted 5 last year but I'm at a 1 now.



    Using the same poll options as the other thread.


    “If so, why?”

    OP’s rating went from 5 down to a 1. No explanation.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 02:58 PM   #4
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    I don’t know how anyone can listen to bartender and call him bad
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    Old 05-03-2019, 03:11 PM   #5
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BruceW View Post
    “If so, why?”

    OP’s rating went from 5 down to a 1. No explanation.
    I felt like I would let the thread breathe for a bit before I post my reasons.. didn't want to stir the pot right away.

    But here goes... I've listened to most shows in '18 and '19. Watched periscopes.. attended four shows last summer.

    To me, he's added no value to the band. I don't notice him at the show or in recordings. If I do notice him, he's because he's blaring the organ. What he plays isn't musically interesting, and the organ sound is laughable.

    On the flip side, I liked Butch. Butch wasn't the greatest piano player either but he added a nice 'jazzy' touch to the music. Loved him in OSW, Jimi, LIOG, Two Step etc.

    The 5 rating last year was based on what I knew at the time. New energetic, happy seemingly fun guy.. who I had hoped would switch over to piano. I don't know how many people thought he would continue playing the organ forever. I get that he sometimes does play piano, but I haven't noticed because it's not interesting to me.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 03:13 PM   #6
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Bmwm3oz View Post
    I felt like I would let the thread breathe for a bit before I post my reasons.. didn't want to stir the pot right away.

    But here goes... I've listened to most shows in '18 and '19. Watched periscopes.. attended four shows last summer.

    To me, he's added no value to the band. I don't notice him at the show or in recordings. If I do notice him, he's because he's blaring the organ. What he plays isn't musically interesting, and the organ sound is laughable.

    On the flip side, I liked Butch. Butch wasn't the greatest piano player either but he added a nice 'jazzy' touch to the music. Loved him in OSW, Jimi, LIOG, Two Step etc.

    The 5 rating last year was based on what I knew at the time. New energetic, happy seemingly fun guy.. who I had hoped would switch over to piano. I don't know how many people thought he would continue playing the organ forever. I get that he sometimes does play piano, but I haven't noticed because it's not interesting to me.
    Once again he doesn’t play organ on every song. Take a listen to the bartender jam and get back to this thread

    Also take a listen to grace and the last stop jam
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    Last edited by tyler3440; 05-03-2019 at 03:15 PM.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 03:19 PM   #7
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tyler3440 View Post
    Once again he doesn’t play organ on every song. Take a listen to the bartender jam and get back to this thread

    Also take a listen to grace and the last stop jam
    Read my last sentence. I get it.

    I will go back and listen though and report back.. but it's not going to change my opinion. I don't think he adds any value to the band. If he wasn't at my next show, I wouldn't notice or care. I never felt this away about Boyd or Butch... it's just my opinion.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 03:29 PM   #8
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    You do know that it's also about how well the musician services the song(s) which can include knowing when to be subtle or shutting up?
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    Old 05-03-2019, 04:57 PM   #9
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Not sure what you’re getting at.

    Bud yes, that’s the very reason I’ve complained so much about TR, who has finally quieted down.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 05:12 PM   #10
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tyler3440 View Post
    Once again he doesn’t play organ on every song. Take a listen to the bartender jam and get back to this thread

    Also take a listen to grace and the last stop jam
    Well, I pulled up SPAC ‘18 Bartender. Buddy played for 30 seconds and it was nothing. What is ‘the bartender jam’? Where is that jam?
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    Old 05-03-2019, 05:31 PM   #11
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Bmwm3oz View Post
    Well, I pulled up SPAC ‘18 Bartender. Buddy played for 30 seconds and it was nothing. What is ‘the bartender jam’? Where is that jam?

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W4M_F1wRteU
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    Old 05-03-2019, 05:36 PM   #12
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Bmwm3oz View Post
    Well, I pulled up SPAC ‘18 Bartender. Buddy played for 30 seconds and it was nothing. What is ‘the bartender jam’? Where is that jam?
    It’s the one from the recent summer tour warmup live album. 12/14/18

    If you can’t hear it your deaf
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    Last edited by tyler3440; 05-03-2019 at 05:40 PM.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 05:54 PM   #13
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Mostly good to very good. Needs to ditch the organ completely though.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 06:02 PM   #14
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Here's a quote (okay I corrected some things and added some other stuff too...) from a post I dropped in the setlist thread on 5/1:

    "Said it before and will again... I really like Buddy, but if having keys it's what's driving playing SU and ED tunes OR if he's still getting the new guy treatment and Dave is playing it safe/conservative for Buddy's sake...? Well, then kick him to the side and get someone that has OR WILL fully versed themself in the catalog and maybe even challenge Dave to play some rare or just different and more tunes.

    At this point, Buddy should know every tune front to back and back to front. He should have listened to several live versions of each tune as well, selecting from different eras with different instrumentation to get a feel and taste of all of the variations. This isn't just being a good employee that values their current situation and their future in the organization, but it should also elevate his value and appreciation within/from the band. I know he's used to more staid sets from the acts he's usually played with, but DMB ain't those folks.

    Were I in his position, I'd be adding quotes from other great songs into solos to let Dave I'm ready/game for any tune. This would have the further benefit of letting the fans know that I'm down with the depth and breadth of the catalog."
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    Old 05-03-2019, 06:05 PM   #15
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tyler3440 View Post
    It’s the one from the recent summer tour warmup live album. 12/14/18

    If you can’t hear it your deaf
    Gonna listen to the whole thing on the way home here shortly. If it sucks, I will hate you .
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    Old 05-03-2019, 06:06 PM   #16
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TheLastPig View Post
    Mostly good to very good. Needs to ditch the organ completely though.
    not entirely...Kill the King, Sweet Up and Down, Everyday, Joyride, Busted Stuff, Louisiana...of course, only two of these songs are in rotation right now
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    Old 05-03-2019, 06:37 PM   #17
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    I like Buddy
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    Old 05-03-2019, 06:47 PM   #18
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Bmwm3oz View Post
    Gonna listen to the whole thing on the way home here shortly. If it sucks, I will hate you .
    Ok cool let us know.
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    Last edited by tyler3440; 05-03-2019 at 06:49 PM.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 06:57 PM   #19
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    It starts shortly after if I had a brain interp
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    Old 05-03-2019, 07:00 PM   #20
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Boston Bartender was a lot better, vocally anyway
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    Old 05-03-2019, 07:22 PM   #21
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Buddy's a great musician. As time goes on, he'll get more in tune with the nuances of certain songs and craft his sound around that. I went with "good but could do more" since he still understandably has some room to grow with this band.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 07:39 PM   #22
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by canes101190 View Post
    Buddy's a great musician. As time goes on, he'll get more in tune with the nuances of certain songs and craft his sound around that. I went with "good but could do more" since he still understandably has some room to grow with this band.
    He's been in the fold a full year at this point though. I'm sure he's being well compensated, so I think he needs to more proactive in regards to learning and knowing the DMB catalog...including the unreleased stuff.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 07:41 PM   #23
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Bmwm3oz View Post
    Well, I pulled up SPAC ‘18 Bartender. Buddy played for 30 seconds and it was nothing. What is ‘the bartender jam’? Where is that jam?
    Try Bartender from WPB, it's very different
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    Old 05-03-2019, 07:47 PM   #24
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by grilldanmo View Post
    He's been in the fold a full year at this point though. I'm sure he's being well compensated, so I think he needs to more proactive in regards to learning and knowing the DMB catalog...including the unreleased stuff.
    You have absolutely no evidence or reason to think he doesn't study the music, so let's just not do this.
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    Old 05-03-2019, 07:54 PM   #25
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by canes101190 View Post
    You have absolutely no evidence or reason to think he doesn't study the music, so let's just not do this.
    good talk

    cheers
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    Old 05-03-2019, 10:04 PM   #26
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Overall I don't think the personnel/talent is the problem with the band, I think they sound good when they play their good material, the problem is the sets are full of their weakest material
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    Old 05-03-2019, 11:22 PM   #27
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by grilldanmo View Post
    Here's a quote (okay I corrected some things and added some other stuff too...) from a post I dropped in the setlist thread on 5/1:

    "Said it before and will again... I really like Buddy, but if having keys it's what's driving playing SU and ED tunes OR if he's still getting the new guy treatment and Dave is playing it safe/conservative for Buddy's sake...? Well, then kick him to the side and get someone that has OR WILL fully versed themself in the catalog and maybe even challenge Dave to play some rare or just different and more tunes.

    At this point, Buddy should know every tune front to back and back to front. He should have listened to several live versions of each tune as well, selecting from different eras with different instrumentation to get a feel and taste of all of the variations. This isn't just being a good employee that values their current situation and their future in the organization, but it should also elevate his value and appreciation within/from the band. I know he's used to more staid sets from the acts he's usually played with, but DMB ain't those folks.

    Were I in his position, I'd be adding quotes from other great songs into solos to let Dave I'm ready/game for any tune. This would have the further benefit of letting the fans know that I'm down with the depth and breadth of the catalog."
    I appreciate what you’re saying man and if this was DMB a decade ago I’m sure that they’d expect this of their newest touring member. I’m also sure that 2019 DMB primarily cares about a unique sound that can cover for the lack of Boyd and still get them through a concert. Maybe I’m wrong but I doubt it.
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    Old 05-04-2019, 08:01 AM   #28
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    Meh. He's a fine player, but I could take him or leave him.
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    Old 05-04-2019, 08:12 AM   #29
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    At first I was indifferent because you didn’t even notice him that much, and when he was audible it seemed to add a nice layer to some of the songs.

    The more and more I’ve heard him though has me really over the ballpark organ at this point. I think that sound is corny in general and would prefer a real piano. The way he plays is so fast and frantic, it’s not enjoyable for me. And they’re bending over backwards to feature him now, which just takes away from the two complementary instruments that make DMB for me (sax and violin).

    With over the top frantic organ, blaring trumpet, bass drum turned up to 11 in the mix, and spaceship sounds electric guitar now, it’s really hard to identify the acoustic driven sound this band was founded on. I’m honestly not motivated to get to any shows the way things are now. There’s better bands to see, which is too bad, because DMB used to be one of the best live shows.
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    Old 05-04-2019, 09:01 AM   #30
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    Re: It's been a year since we rated Buddy, let's revisit

    ^ this, and this is why my only show this year is a D&T show
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