Conspiracy Theory 101

[Climb2safety]

Originally Posted by Gene Parmesan

Here is the fallacy of religion. I don't know=God.

You bring god up a lot, and religion too, and not in a very good light so I thought I’d ask, what is your personal story with god or religion?

It’s one thing to not believe, but at least in your posts you swing so far to mocking the whole concept and those that do believer, and actively trying to tear down the possible notion of go. So you go way beyond any semblance of tolerance so I thought I’d ask.

What’s made you so anti God?

It can’t just be evangelicals, or the crusaders, right? And there are a lot of religions too.

Anyway, answer if you want. You keep bringing it up and poking and making fun so I thought maybe you’d like to explain why.

[kydmb99]

Originally Posted by Gene Parmesan

Here is the fallacy of religion. I don't know=God.

First, god is not synonymous with Religion.

Second, no one has any certain idea of how life originated. At this point, everything is a theory. Believing that intelligent, conscious life just somehow happened under these perfect circumstances without any sort of direction is a form of faith. No one observed it. No one recorded it. There are scientists who are creationists so the idea that it’s “settled science” is inaccurate. At this point, everyone is trying to make a best guess based on the information we have.

I don’t believe in god because “I don’t know so I’ll take the lazy way out and say God” (which seems to be the implication here). It’s because I look at us, our world and our universe and it just makes more sense to me that it was created. I see order and evidence of intentional, intelligent design when I study the world and I infer from that that it was designed. I don’t believe that’s “anti-science” at all.

The notion that you can’t be scientific and believe in intelligent design needs to be re-evaluated imo

[dre2142]

Originally Posted by Climb2safety

You bring god up a lot, and religion too, and not in a very good light so I thought I’d ask, what is your personal story with god or religion?

It’s one thing to not believe, but at least in your posts you swing so far to mocking the whole concept and those that do believer, and actively trying to tear down the possible notion of go. So you go way beyond any semblance of tolerance so I thought I’d ask.

What’s made you so anti God?

It can’t just be evangelicals, or the crusaders, right? And there are a lot of religions too.

Anyway, answer if you want. You keep bringing it up and poking and making fun so I thought maybe you’d like to explain why.

ok, we get it. you think a big man in the sky created the universe. your condescending attitude isnt helping. have you not been mocking the scientific side of this in the meantime? and really, you telling someone to educate themselves more on a subject is funny.

[Climb2safety]

Mentions the watchmaker

[Climb2safety]

Originally Posted by dre2142

ok, we get it. you think a big man in the sky created the universe.

If he’s going to crap on religion at every turn, and that’s all he’s adding I think I asked a fair question in a polite manor. My beliefs are not relevant. Why do people keep bringing them up?

Maybe he needs to unburden.

You never posted how you think life began.

[dre2142]

Originally Posted by Climb2safety

This is just something I ponder is all. I assumed people scientifically inclined (which I also consider myself to be) would be thinking about the possibilities as well.

Edit: what are the specifics of the science camp then

Big Bang theory- backed up by scientific evidence, endorsed by majority of cosmologists and physicists.

[DMBstandUP1984]

Originally Posted by dre2142

Big Bang theory- backed up by scientific evidence, endorsed by majority of cosmologists and physicists.

Bazinga!

[Climb2safety]

Originally Posted by DMBstandUP1984

Bazinga!

The question wasn’t how the universe was created but that’s fine.

[scrock25]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abiogenesis

[DMBstandUP1984]

Originally Posted by Climb2safety

The question wasn’t how the universe was created but that’s fine.

I just wanted to use a big bang theory (tv show) reference there..I haven't back read at all

[Climb2safety]

Originally Posted by DMBstandUP1984

I just wanted to use a big bang theory (tv show) reference there..I haven't back read at all

Oh yeah, I got that.

I was just passive aggressively quoting you to say something to Dre. Hope you don’t mind.

[TheLastPig]

Originally Posted by scrock25

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abiogenesis

if this doesnt answer his question im going to resort to thinking he's trying to convince us there had to have been a god to make that happen.

[DMBstandUP1984]

Originally Posted by Climb2safety

Oh yeah, I got that.

I was just passive aggressively quoting you to say something to Dre. Hope you don’t mind.

all good.

[Jonny Veritas 2]

Originally Posted by Climb2safety

I cleared that up though. And I don’t think it’s one or the other, in fact my church recognizes both.

For this discussion I hoped to help religion out of it and ask straight forward questions about what people believed did happen and how,life was formed with out a creator acting on it.

So far I think I’m the only one to have answered the question, and I’ve gotten a few who clearly refute a creator but don’t seem to have any other theories.

I will use stars as a perfect example. The only theory to the "creation" of stars and the cosmos was once that they had to be "created" by a maker. The conundrum here is though, stars are continuing to form literally everyday. As we know from the book of Genesis, it claims that God created the heavens and the earth and there it stood. But, it is actually still very much being "created" today as we speak.

Stars begin as interstellar gas that form molecular clouds. Atoms bind together (CO and H2 the most common in interstellar gas) Dense parts of the clouds eventually collapse under their own weight and gravity and a protostar forms. Loose gas from this process falls to its center releasing kinetic energy in the form of heat. As these temperatures and pressure increases thermonuclear fusion begins. Once a star becomes a hydrogen burning star, this process of nuclear fusion creates ALL elements (as seen in your periodic table up in every science classroom ever) through a process called nucleosynthesis. 2 atoms of hydrogen basically fuse together to form 1 atom of helium and the rest escapes as "pure energy"

This process of nuclear fusion is quite literally how a star is born. And yes, we absolutely could recreate this in a lab if we as humans had the means to generate such high temperatures needed to produce fusion. We have nowhere remotely close to that ability because those temperatures are unfathomably hot (the temps high enough to create the elements on the periodic table) But, if we could create temperatures high enough to trigger fusion, we could absolutely without a doubt "make a star" No creationism needed.

This same concept can be applied to creation of life. We cannot recreate it because there are gaps in the formation of cells and DNA that we simply do not know. Just because we don't yet understand them does not mean they do not exist. There have been life forms detected on planets that thrive in pure methane. Clearly a creature of our own DNA could not survive this, however that doesn't mean that a "primordial soup" of a different "recipe" could not. This idea is not perfect by any means. It is not definitive or 100 % fact. But, with all due respect to creationist, there is mountains of evidence to support this somewhat disjointed path is the correct idea, while there is just simply is no scientific evidence whatsoever to support creationism.

My point being, star formation seemed completely incomprehensible to the human mind once upon a time. With knowledge, came understanding. This process of star formation can take up to 10 million years! Supernovas happen regularly where stars explode releasing millions of times more energy than our sun will produce in its lifetime, in mere seconds. This quite literally means elements are thrown all about the universe. These elements are the exact same elements needed to create the formation of life as we know it. Which is where transpermia theory comes into play, that the elements found in abundance throughout the universe were brought here, (supernovas, comets, asteroids, space debris) and with enough time, similar to a star formation, the building blocks of life arise. This theory would quite literally make us, children of the stars. It's just difficult to imagine that it is coincidental that the elements needed for human life are found (and formed) in the cosmos in abundance, and the two are not related.

To those of you who read this. You deserve a medal for sticking with me through my novel....

[Gene Parmesan]

Originally Posted by Climb2safety

You bring god up a lot, and religion too, and not in a very good light so I thought I’d ask, what is your personal story with god or religion? I didn't bring up God. I never bring up God.

It’s one thing to not believe, but at least in your posts you swing so far to mocking the whole concept and those that do believer, and actively trying to tear down the possible notion of go. So you go way beyond any semblance of tolerance so I thought I’d ask.

What’s made you so anti God? I'm not anti God, I'm anti humans preaching their mythology

It can’t just be evangelicals, or the crusaders, right? And there are a lot of religions too. Don't understand the question, but yes there are lots of different religions. Should be a clue about their individual validity.

Anyway, answer if you want. You keep bringing it up and poking and making fun so I thought maybe you’d like to explain why.

Religion is man's attempt to make sense of what we don't know. I have no problem with wanting to know answers. Science has a similar objective. My problem lies in the 'spread the word' aspect of religion. Nobody has any answers to spread. But spread them they do with self righteousness as if faith is an argument.

"My argument is true because I believe it to be"
Try that with any subject besides religion and be laughed out of the room.

[BTBaboon]

Originally Posted by TheLastPig

if this doesnt answer his question im going to resort to thinking he's trying to convince us there had to have been a god to make that happen.

I think the problem with what Climb was posting yesterday, he's searching for a "poof" when that isn't what happens. As we were discussing yesterday, we struggle to comprehend the vastness not only of space, but time.

Climb is looking for what the process is of no life -> "poof" -> life. When in fact it is far more complicated and spans far more time than we can easily comprehend. There is no "poof", there's a long process that resulted in the first forms of simply life.

Further, I don't understand why that can't also be consistent with a creator. A creator allows for that process to occur, no? What's the alternative? That one day there was no life and then God deemed it to be so and "poof!" - life exists now?

[dre2142]

Originally Posted by Climb2safety

The question wasn’t how the universe was created but that’s fine.

one and the same. the basis of one leads to the other.

easier answer- definitely not by divine intervention in 6 days. (in my opinion) or do you believe in the creation of the universe scientifically but not in life?

[Jonny Veritas 2]

BTBaboon
What's the alternative? That one day there was no life and then God deemed it to be so and "poof!" - life exists now?

From what I understand, that seems to precisely be the idea that creationists follow. As told in the book of Genesis and the 7 day creationism theory. Simple carbon- dating can prove this as absolute nonsense. Not saying there was no creator, but it most certainly did not happen the way the book of Genesis claims that it did. Science tells us that is impossible.

[TheLastPig]

Originally Posted by Jonny Veritas 2

BTBaboon
What's the alternative? That one day there was no life and then God deemed it to be so and "poof!" - life exists now?

From what I understand, that seems to precisely be the idea that creationists follow. As told in the book of Genesis and the 7 day creationism theory. Simple carbon- dating can prove this as absolute nonsense. Not saying there was no creator, but it most certainly did not happen the way the book of Genesis claims that it did. Science tells us that is impossible.

Which is exactly why I find organized religion to be absolute nonsense. When you start picking and choosing which parts of these sacred texts are the true parts, the whole structure of the thing falls out from the bottom.


I truly believe there is something to spirituality, but its mostly within oneself and there are many means upon finding it. Some people do use religion to get there, which I can understand. But saying words in your head to some being that has no proof of existence, or going weekly to sit on some wooden benches in a building deemed a special place seems like nothing but a giant waste of time and energy. There are much more constructive and invigorating means of acquiring that peace of mind and understanding of good.


Not to get too deep into philosophical talk.

[Jonny Veritas 2]

Originally Posted by TheLastPig

Which is exactly why I find organized religion to be absolute nonsense. When you start picking and choosing which parts of these sacred texts are the true parts, the whole structure of the thing falls out from the bottom.


I truly believe there is something to spirituality, but its mostly within oneself and there are many means upon finding it. Some people do use religion to get there, which I can understand. But saying words in your head to some being that has no proof of existence, or going weekly to sit on some wooden benches in a building deemed a special place seems like nothing but a giant waste of time and energy. There are much more constructive and invigorating means of acquiring that peace of mind and understanding of good.


Not to get too deep into philosophical talk.

Agreed. And, well said!

[BTBaboon]

Going to break the 4th wall a bit and just say I chuckled when I realized we're discussing creationism and evolution in a conspiracy theory thread.

[Climb2safety]

Originally Posted by BTBaboon

Going to break the 4th wall a bit and just say I chuckled when I realized we're discussing creationism and evolution in a conspiracy theory thread.

I thought the same thing. It honestly seems like an appropriate place.

[currupt3d**]

The Flat Earth one is entertaining. Not just the theory (lol) itself but the people who believe and put time into exploring it. One of the best examples of how internet trolls can legit trick a decent size group of people into believing pseudo-science. Like not one of them can go "there sure are a lot of people involved in space and rocket research, how could not ONE of them have exposed this yet?".

[Route_2]

Originally Posted by currupt3d**

The Flat Earth one is entertaining. Not just the theory (lol) itself but the people who believe and put time into exploring it. One of the best examples of how internet trolls can legit trick a decent size group of people into believing pseudo-science. Like not one of them can go "there sure are a lot of people involved in space and rocket research, how could not ONE of them have exposed this yet?".

I saw this van in a hotel parking lot a few weekends ago. Wasn't able to meet the owner unfortunately.

[Foreverford05]

It's the guubment', dude. Lies

[BTBaboon]

Originally Posted by Route_2

I saw this van in a hotel parking lot a few weekends ago. Wasn't able to meet the owner unfortunately.

"By the way gravity is a hoax"

Love that

[mthawk07]

Every flat earth theory, all I can think of is the old lady in the Esurance commercial. "That's not how it works, that's not how any of this works."

[Climb2safety]

Manson the lost tapes on fox tonight.

Really good. Tons of video and audio and video I’ve never seen. Worth a watch.

[ExistenceNow]

One of my true crime podcasts was advertising for that yesterday. May check it out.

[jcc522]

Why did WTC 7 fall?