guitar lessons - Page 3 - Antsmarching.org Forums - Dave Matthews Band Discussion
Old 02-05-2010, 08:21 AM   #61
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Re: guitar lessons

Resatka just wanted to say thanks for this. Very helpful stuff.

And a question, how can you easily tell what key a song is in?

EDIT: Didnt realize haybale97 just asked the same question
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  • Old 02-05-2010, 10:13 AM   #62
    Resatka
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Alright to tell what key a song is in.... there are many ways to do it. I think I might do an audio lesson because figuring out the key is probably something you're not going to find online very easily, and none of the videos explain how to do so. I'll post the different methods sometime early next week. My audio lesson will explain everything in detail, with actual sound examples, so you can hear how to do it. It's honestly not that hard though, especially if you're learning blues and mostly rock. But if you just want to be able to know what key ANY song is in, and want to know how to play in ALL the keys, and know how to explore the keys, there are steps you gotta take to get to that skill level.


    The first few ways I'm going to show you are extremely practical, however they don't really involve theory. I will also teach you guys theory, step by step, so that by the time we get to the good stuff, you'll completely understand everything. You should know theory because then you'll know how songs work and how they're written. You'll also know how to write your own songs, and maybe even cover your own versions of the songs you love.I'll also post a lesson on that as well.


    The first and most simple way to figuring out what key a song is in is by looking at the chords that the song revolves around. I'm sure you've heard of chord progressions. Later on I'll teach you how chord progressions work and the basic rules behind them (music theory), but for now, all you need to know is what the order of the chords are.


    First, pick a song you want to learn, or maybe a song you want to learn to solo to.


    Look at sheet music or tab and look for the chords. Let's say the song was this:

    http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/tabs/..._black_tab.htm


    That's an ACDC song. The reason I picked this song was because it's simple. The main riff of the song uses 3 chords. The main riff is also what the guitar solo plays over.


    In the song, you can obviously hear that the song revolves around the E power chord, simply because it's what the song starts on, and the chords revolve back to that chord. You can also hear that E is the tonic, or the root note, of the entire song. Playing E notes and screwing around to see if they match up will definitely confirm this. Also if you look at the tab for the guitar solo, you can see that the solo outlines an E minor pentatonic scale (if you didn't know this, now you know).


    So that song is in a form of E minor pentatonic. Alright, so what about a major and minor key?


    Let's look at a major key. Here's the tab for the first few bars of the Allman Bros. song, Blue Sky.


    E--0------------2---------0--------0-------|
    B--0------------3---------2--------0-------|
    G--1------------2---------2--------1-------|
    D--2------------0---------2--------2-------|
    A--2------------x---------0--------2-------|
    E--0------------x---------x--------0-------|


    Hold on I need to make another post, my words are going off the page.
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    Old 02-05-2010, 10:23 AM   #63
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Awesome a sticky for this thread. Again thanks for all this Resatka.
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    Old 02-05-2010, 10:40 AM   #64
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Alright so Blue Sky. As you can see in the first few bars, this section STARTS and ENDS with an E major chord. Also the guitar melodies all use notes within E major. Chances are this song is in E major. So how do I know their soloing in E major? Well, look at the guitar solo's tab. The notes are from the E major scale.


    I'd like to get you started on this approach so you can start figuring out songs on your own. Eventually I will teach you skills and tools that will help you even more. With this initial method before I show you more, the problems with this approach that have not been solved are this:

    - Modes sometimes revolve around minor and major chords, so just because a song revolves around them doesn't mean the song is in major or minor exactly.

    So just because a song is based around E major for example doesn't mean it's in E major. It could also be E mixolydian (common as HELL in jamband music) OR it could be in E lydian, simply because those are the only two modes other than the major scale that revolve around a major chord. So you could think it's in E major, but I might not be.


    -If you don't know your scales and chords that revolve around specific keys and modes, then figuring out what key it's in can be somewhat difficult.


    So here's the solution:



    -Memorizing which chords belong to which keys. This is probably the most important thing and I'll show you how to properly memorize this. You'll also know how chords work in music and how to create your own if you'd like.
    -You're going to have to start learning all the notes that are in each keys. I will show you a few common ways to memorize them that make it x1000 easier and you will know your scales within a few weeks or maybe even less if you memorize them well. This ties in completely with memorizing chords.
    -Practicing playing and soloing in all keys so that you become completely familiar with it.






    Another method to figuring out what song a key is in.......

    Perfect pitch. Or forms of it.



    I do NOT want to sound conceited or cocky or ANYTHING like that, because people have taken it that way in the past, but I actually have it.... it's pretty awesome because I can listen to literally almost any song and instantly know what key it's in. It's been a great skill to have for learning songs, jamming, songwriting, and playing with my band.

    So the question is, how did I figure out that I have it? Simply by fucking around. I listened to a ton of classic rock songs when I was in 8th grade, and I realized that a lot of them sounded the same. I then looked at the tabs, and figured out that a lot of them were in A minor or A minor pentatonic. I then figured out what that key sounds like, so every time I heard a song in that key, I instantly knew it. Over the years of figuring out what keys songs were in, I learned all the keys from thousands of songs, and I learned what each key sounds like over time.


    So what does this mean for you? Well if you have perfect pitch and don't know it, I can show you how to figure out if you do. In the mean time, even if you DON'T, the time figuring it out won't be wasted, simply because you'll be learning out how to figure out keys along the way. It's a win win combo really and you have nothing to lose.


    Blues songs and rock songs are GREAT to start with simply because they're pretty easy to figure out, and a lot of them are in the same key.


    So this ends my post for today. I will post back next week. Next week I will post a lesson on


    - figuring out keys by messing around
    - how songs sound similar
    - how to figure out what chords are in which keys
    - basic music theory


    .... in the mean time, I would:

    - practice the scales I showed you. Within a few weeks you'll see that the scales I showed you and the chords I'll teach you will all come together nicely and conveniently, and hopefully you'll be more than glad you learned them

    - watch a few of the videos. Start trying to learn a few licks

    - if there's a song you've been dying to learn, start looking at the tabs. Try learning a few licks from the songs.


    If there are any songs in which you want to know the key for, ask me. Just post the song and I can tell you. Also next week I'll send you guys Guitar Pro. Take care and have a good weekend!
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    Old 02-05-2010, 10:42 AM   #65
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Awesome a sticky! It looks like Antsmarching is liking the free lessons! For anybody that's already pretty good and simply wants to get better, I can also do a few PM messages as well. Tell any other Ants that want to learn this kind of stuff to come to this thread, whether they're already good or would like to learn. Thanks guys!
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    Old 02-05-2010, 10:55 AM   #66
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    Re: guitar lessons

    BTW If anyone, whether you've posted in this thread yet or not, has a question PLEASE let me know. Sometimes these things can be confusing and I want to make sure everyone understands what I say in each post.
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    Old 02-05-2010, 11:19 AM   #67
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    Re: guitar lessons

    we can thank wonderwoman for the sticky. awesome stuff resatka
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    Old 02-05-2010, 11:48 AM   #68
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    Re: guitar lessons

    How about a sticky thread where Resatka has full control and can edit the first post to keep all the tutorials in one spot, rather than scattered throughout a thread!!?!?
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    Old 02-05-2010, 12:38 PM   #69
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Whatever works for you guys. I'm just here to help. I'll do whatever the admins see fit.
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    Old 02-06-2010, 09:32 AM   #70
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Alright guys, monday I'm posting a lesson on how to link the modes and scales together that I showed you so that you know how to flow across the entire fretboard in one key. I just can't because I got the girlfriend visiting me
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    Old 02-06-2010, 10:59 AM   #71
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Resatka View Post
    Alright guys, monday I'm posting a lesson on how to link the modes and scales together that I showed you so that you know how to flow across the entire fretboard in one key. I just can't because I got the girlfriend visiting me
    at least you got your priorities straight. leave your socks on when you get sum...you'll be badass
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    Old 02-07-2010, 10:55 AM   #72
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Hell yeah. Alright so today's the super bowl, and I got work in a little bit. Got the lesson all planned out. Afterwords you'll see how the scales relate to one another and soloists slip in and out between the two
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    Old 02-07-2010, 04:23 PM   #73
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Awesome thread. Just wanted to say thanks. I'm somewhat of a beginner and i have been trying to learn scales. This is the best explanation I've seen yet. Can't wait for more! Great job.
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    Old 02-07-2010, 05:21 PM   #74
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    Re: guitar lessons

    yeah i've got a question about bending, how do you know how far to bend up to bend a whole step, half step up etc?
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    Old 02-07-2010, 05:49 PM   #75
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by haybale97 View Post
    yeah i've got a question about bending, how do you know how far to bend up to bend a whole step, half step up etc?
    Use your ear. That's really the only way to do it.
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    Old 02-07-2010, 06:10 PM   #76
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by haybale97 View Post
    yeah i've got a question about bending, how do you know how far to bend up to bend a whole step, half step up etc?
    To get bending down, basically play the note that you're starting with, then see what the note you're going to bend to next sounds like, without bending. Just simply play it. Then try to reach the note that you're trying to bend to, which is the note you just heard.

    Just practice it so that you know how to bend to that certain interval every time, without thinking. Eventually you should be able to play certain things without thinking. It's a nice thing called muscle memory
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    Old 02-08-2010, 06:13 PM   #77
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Sorry guys for the delay! Here's the audio file for my lesson:

    http://www.sendspace.com/file/zzdqsk


    And here are the scales shapes you're going to need for the lesson:

    G Mixolydian pattern:


    http://all-guitar-chords.com/guitar_...t&t=0&choice=1


    A Aeolian pattern:

    http://all-guitar-chords.com/guitar_...t&t=0&choice=1



    Alright so clip number one in the lesson is basically just me going up and down the G mixolyidan pattern


    Clip number two is my going up and down the A Aeolian pattern.


    The next clip is me going between the two patterns, one by me going all the way up the G mixolyidan scale and then down the A aeolian scale. The 4th clip is me going up the G mixolydian scale, about half way, then sliding into the A aeolian scale, then going to the top of that, then going back down it, then halfway down sliding back into the G mixolydian pattern.


    Why am I transitioning between these two shapes? Going between patterns is very important. As you can see, both these patterns are based off of C. Because they're both part of C, we could use these patterns to solo over a song in C. Also because they have the same notes in common, we can use them both over the same song, so why not learn to use both of them together? If you do this, you have a much wider selection of notes to choose from. You want to use different notes and octaves to get different sounds. You'd sound extremely stale if you just played in one part of the neck your entire life don't you think? This solves that problem.

    Basically by linking all the different scale shapes together (scales shapes from the same key), it gives you a map of the fretboard, and on that map it tells you which notes to use and which not to use, depending on what key you're in. Now you have many more notes to choose from AND it gives you more room to work with. This is critical to exceptional soloing, whether it's learning a song in a certain key, creating your own licks, or simply improvising.


    The next clip is an example of learning melodic licks and applying them to the scale shapes we've learned. The solo is improvised, however it only contains notes from the two scale shapes that I've posted, just so that you can see even a small part of the fretboard can generate a solo. Imagine if you had the entire fretboard to work with. You can do a lot more.


    The last clip is basically me playing an improvised melodic solo over some chords with actual rhythm. This is just to show you how licks within scales can be applied with actual music that accompanies it.


    So basically this means....


    1) Learn scale shapes
    2) Learn to link them together
    3) Learn or create licks with the shapes and scales
    4) Apply the licks to actual music




    Alright so some people will probably have a few questions. If anyone has ANY, whether it's about something earlier or this post, feel free to ask. The method you choose to ask if up to you. If you want to reply directly in this thread like others have, go for it. If you want to PM a question and don't feel like posting it, that's totally cool too. I just hope you guys are finding these "lessons" useful.
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    Old 02-08-2010, 06:54 PM   #78
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    Re: guitar lessons

    fantastic, i'm going to get working on these as soon as i finish this work.
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    Old 02-08-2010, 08:36 PM   #79
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    Alright, now I'm a bit confused. I thought whatever note I based the pattern off of that was what key I would be playing in. For ex. on the Mixolodian pattern it starts on a G but it's obviously in the key of C.
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    Old 02-08-2010, 09:46 PM   #80
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by CGTP13 View Post
    Alright, now I'm a bit confused. I thought whatever note I based the pattern off of that was what key I would be playing in. For ex. on the Mixolodian pattern it starts on a G but it's obviously in the key of C.
    Well see here's how G mixolyidan is part of C major (I explained this before but it might not have been clear):


    C Major (all white keys on the piano)

    C D E F G A B C


    C Major (extended)

    C D E F G A B C D E F G


    Start and end C major on G instead of C itself:

    G A B C D E F G


    That is what a mode is. G mixolyidan is a mode of C major. It is rooted in the note G but not the key. It could also be played over a G major chord, but that's not the G major scale so it would sound different. This is why each mode has it's own unique sound.

    The only mode who's root note corresponds with the key you're actually playing in is the Ionian mode... which is 100% identical to the Major scale. They are one in the same.

    If you played a G mixolyidan mode (or the notes of C major) over a G major chord or a chord progression leading to G), it would sound similar to some type of jam band song if you play the right licks. This is also who learning modes is great because they offer different tastes.
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    Old 02-08-2010, 09:48 PM   #81
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Alright I see what you're saying .
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    Old 02-09-2010, 01:47 PM   #82
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Alright so now that you know how licks are based part of how you phrase the notes, you have two thirds of soloing down. Scales and licks.


    So the other 3rd is mood, context, style, key, etc. which we will need to know theory.

    I will try making this as painless as possible. Once you have this down, and you can connect theory with your own playing and learning, then you've hit a HUGE landmark in your playing.



    So we're studying tonal music. Tonal music is basically everything you most likely listen to. It encompasses modern rock, blues, pop, funk, aspects of jazz and classical music, progressive, folk, etc. You get the idea.


    The vast majority of the music you listen to is based off of the structure of the major scale.


    So how does the major scale work? We it's made up of 7 different notes. How do we know which notes? The major scale is created using a specific sequence of distances between each note. The distance between two notes is called an interval.


    So what intervals does the major scale use? Will it uses it's own sequence of whole steps and half steps between each note in the scale.


    A half step on guitar:

    Bottom E string: E|------- 10-----11----|

    A whole step on guitar:

    Bottom E string: E|-------10----12-----|


    We're going to use C major as the key we base all the concepts off of.


    C D E F G A B C


    and the intervals between each note....


    C (W) D (W) E (H) F (W) G (W) A (W) B (H) C


    Logically, the W's between each note are whole steps, and the H's between each note are half steps. So that sequence is:

    WWHWWWH


    This is how the scales you play are constructed. All based off of this one repeating "pattern" of intervals.


    I'll let you guys read the past two lessons, and in a few hours, I'll explain how chords work and basic chord progressions, so you can see why certain songs play the chords that they do and such.
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    Old 02-09-2010, 05:16 PM   #83
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    Re: guitar lessons

    keep em comin guy
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    Old 02-09-2010, 09:23 PM   #84
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Alright so chords and scales... how do they relate?


    A chord is obviously two or more notes played simultaneously. You can create tonal chords (like a G major chord, an A minor chord, an F# Major chord) by using notes within the major scale. So chords contain notes that belong to the key that the song is in. This is pretty obvious...


    So how are chords created from the major scale? Which notes create which chords?


    It's really easy. Basic "full" chords (like the tonal ones I just mentioned) all mainly use 3.


    Here's how we make a chord....


    Let's take the major scale:

    C D E F G A B C


    Alright so to form a chord using a scale, you need to pick the root note. Let's pick C for simplicity sake.

    (C) D E F G A B C


    So that's our root. Now to create a C chord (here it will obviously be a C major chord), just take C then add on two more notes. These notes are basically "every other" note after C. You do this only twice.


    (C) D (E) F (G) A B | (C) <---- notes in the chord can repeat.

    So if we use every other note, and play the selected ones together in unison, you will form a chord. From this chord above, the notes spell out:

    CEG (the extra C note can be written in like CEG, but it's not entirely needed. You don't need two C notes to make a C chord. You only need one)

    So if you use this method with a different note, you'll get a different chord. For example....


    Let's pick F from the C major scale this time, and builds the 3 notes I need to make a chord.

    Pick every other note twice (and add the root again if you'd like......

    (F) G (A) B (C) D E F


    An F major chord is spell FAC as shown above.


    These "groupings" of 3 notes, using the method I showed above, are called Triads. Triads basically make up all tonal chords.


    Using the method above, you can figure out all the proper chords (the triads) that fit with a key, for example:

    (C) D (E) F (G) A B (C) -----> CEG (C major chord)

    (D) E (F) G (A) B C (D) -----> DFA (D minor chord)

    (E) F (G) A (B) C D (E) -----> EGB (E minor chord)

    (F) G (A) B (C) D E (F) -----> FAC (F major chord)

    (G) A (B) C (D) E F (G) ----> GBD (G major chord)

    (A) B (C) D (E) F G (A) ----> ACE (A minor chord)

    (B) C (D) E (F) G A (B) ----> BDF (B diminished chord)



    You're probably wondering "well how the hell do you know if it's major or minor?"

    It's all about the intervals. When certain intervals clash, they created different feelings.

    Basically a major chord is the root note, then the second note is two whole steps away from it. To add the 3rd note in the chord, it's a half step then a whole step from the 2nd note.

    A minor chord is constructed by doing the exact opposite. You pick the root note, then the next note is a whole step then a half step, and then the 3rd note is 2 whole steps away from the 2nd note.


    You can confirm these things by looking at the frets on your guitar.


    Anyways, there's a few things you should know:

    Let's take a C major chord

    CEG

    The first note is called the ROOT.

    The middle note is called the 3rd. Why? Because it's the 3rd note up from the root. Look:

    (1) 2 (3)
    ----C D E F G A B C

    Then the 3rd note is called the 5th, because it's 5 notes away from the first one

    (1) 2 (3) 4 (5)
    ----C D E F G A B C



    So basically, the root, 3rd and 5th make up the notes of a chord.


    So you're probably wondering what a diminished chord is. Basically the spacing from the root is a whole step plus a half step, and then the 5th is a half step plus a whole step again from the 3rd. This chord is extremely dissonant (not pleasing to the ear), and is neither major nor minor. I'll show you how this kind of chord is used in songs later.


    Before I move on do I have any questions? This was a lengthy post so I wouldn't be surprised.
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    Old 02-10-2010, 09:26 AM   #85
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    Re: guitar lessons

    So for a minor scale or chord all you do is flat the 3rd?
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    Old 02-10-2010, 10:58 AM   #86
    Resatka
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by CGTP13 View Post
    So for a minor scale or chord all you do is flat the 3rd?
    The minor scale is different, it's more than just the 3rd, but pretty much the only difference between a major chord triad and a minor chord triad is the 3rd, so for chords you'd be absolutely correct. Nice observation.


    There's actually other names for intervals. They can be called "major", "minor", "perfect", "augmented", and "diminished". I should teach this right now because it totally ties into chords.


    Basically, you start with a root note. Depending on how far certain notes are from the root note, you give each of those notes certain "interval names" in relation to the root you start with.


    All the interval names are based off the major scale, which is great for us because we can once again work with C.

    If we start with the root note of a major scale, which here happens to be C, we can give each note after C an interval name that tells us how far it is from C.


    So without changing any of the notes (making them sharp or flat), here's what the first set of names are.


    C to D is called a major 2nd (the 2nd note in relation to the root).

    C to E is called a major 3rd (the 3rd note in relation to the root).

    C to F is called a perfect 4th (the 4th note in relation to the root).

    C to G is called a perfect 5th (the 5th note in relation to the root).

    C to A is called a major 6th (the 6th note in relation to the root).

    C to B is called a major 7th. (the 7th note in relation to the root).

    C to the C is called an octave (you probably knew this).



    So basically, the 2nd note in the major scale (before altering anything) will always be a major 2nd away from the root note. Same for the 3rd note, and so on. Pretty easy.


    This means that the number of notes away from the initial note will determine the "interval number", meaning 3rd, 4th, 5th, etc.

    So two (alphabetic) notes away from the first note is always called a 2nd, three (alphabetic) notes away from the first note is called a 3rd, and so on.

    It's all about how far the number of musical "letters" are away from each other to determine the number.

    So how do we know if the interval is always major, minor, etc?

    There are two schools of thought. Intervals can be defined in another equivalent way.

    As usual there are patterns we start to see.


    Notice how E to two whole steps up from C:


    (C) - (D) - (E)



    I said early that C to E is a major 3rd. For all intervals, for example a major 3rd, are always fixed, meaning they're always the same distance. So another way to think of major 3rd is you start with ANY note, then add the next alphabetic note two whole steps about it.


    If we picked F for example, you'd see that two whole steps up from it is A. A would be a major third away from F due to the rule I just said.




    So now you're wondering how do you get minor/diminished/augmented intervals?



    I will explain that as soon as I get back from lunch if I got any questions between now and then feel free to ask.
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    Old 02-10-2010, 02:27 PM   #87
    Resatka
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Actually I'll just let people read these, ask things as usual, then move to the next thing.
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    Old 02-10-2010, 06:14 PM   #88
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mdmarvich View Post
    I would like to learn these, too!
    Wow. You do not strike me as a musical person.
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    Old 02-11-2010, 09:31 AM   #89
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    Re: guitar lessons

    okay i have a question. say i want to play a song in the key of D, do i just have to move the root of the ionian scale down a whole step and do the same with the rest of the scales to play in d?
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    Old 02-11-2010, 02:03 PM   #90
    Resatka
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    Re: guitar lessons

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by haybale97 View Post
    okay i have a question. say i want to play a song in the key of D, do i just have to move the root of the ionian scale down a whole step and do the same with the rest of the scales to play in d?
    I'm confused by your question. I said this earlier, but the Ionian mode and the major scale are the exact same thing. The only reason the major scale got a mode name too was because all the other notes had names from modes as well.

    If you take the major scale/ionian scale pattern and you start the pattern on D, THEN you'd be playing in D major.


    For example:

    D Major

    http://all-guitar-chords.com/guitar_...t&t=0&choice=1


    D Ionian

    http://all-guitar-chords.com/guitar_...t&t=0&choice=1


    As you can see, it is exactly the same thing. Does that answer your question?
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