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Old 11-15-2021, 08:28 PM   #1351
karczews41
 
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Re: the (2021) summer so far

Quote:
Originally Posted by kenticus View Post
Feel bad for those who have gone to an insane amount of shows - I’ve been to 7 and have gotten full last stop (mid-set), break for it, captain (the one time they did the outro extended), DIDO, the only full two step of 2016, you never know, and sweet up and down. So I have been spoiled.

Pretty lucky on rarities for first show having been 7-4-2010
From my experience it's a crap shoot on rarities unless you hit SPAC, Gorge or some of the multi-night venues where they play every year. I think I've seen nearly every album song (except stand alone ABI, Grux, full #34/35, Angel, Mother Father, DOOF, Sleep to Dream Her, and several Some Devil songs) because I've tried to focus my time/money on attending the multi-night shows, and I've been lucky.

Edit, I forgot I did get #34 but I have no recollection of it.

Last edited by karczews41; 11-15-2021 at 08:29 PM.
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  • Old 11-15-2021, 08:57 PM   #1352
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Nice to see that outside the Caravan and Covid shortened 2020 this year there were the least amount of DDTW's since 2006. They still played it a lot more than I care for but nice to see that it didn't hit more than 19 for the tour.

    Any versions post roi that aren't dave and tim are subpar to me. Whereas the leave me praying's and buth era DDTW's with the keys are so much better.
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    Old 11-18-2021, 01:01 AM   #1353
    Xcacel
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    the (2021) summer so far

    Some fun stats from DMB Society:

    https://images2.imgbox.com/09/f6/jT2i6Zb8_o.jpeg

    Third Verse: Grey Street was the most played song, 26 times in 43 show, so if you were going to a show, you had 60% possibility to hear it. And many people enjoyed that

    Your Favorite : Can’t Stop was played 21 times (!!), which it makes the 3rd most played song (together with Nancies, SMTS and Too Much). Dave was a bit sadistic in this.

    • Windows was the most played encore: 12 times. Really overplayed

    • Seek Up was the top opener. Most people had other expectations, but I can live with that.

    • At the end the Big Three were the three most played albums. 313 songs over 871 total played: 36% of the song played in this tour were from the Big Three.

    • Away From The World was the less played album. More or less 3% of the songs in the tour. Considering that is the second-last album, this is quite surprising. Even Come Tomorrow wasn’t played that much, overall.

    • 120 different songs played in this tour, to me is quite a good rotation. But I don’t know what was the average on previous tours. Of course, we all know that Dreaming Tree was missed in this tour, and maybe this cannot be forgiven.

    Last edited by Xcacel; 11-18-2021 at 01:03 AM.
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    Old 11-18-2021, 11:17 AM   #1354
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Foreverford05 View Post
    Me as well; I had a blast at MPP even though it wasn't a super highlighted stop of the tour, but if gave me my only DIDO to date, which made the show a win for me.

    I go into shows pretty drunk with zero expectations anymore and come out very satisfied. Just hope they keep touring for a few more years.
    I'm with you! There are definite songs I wanna hear or that are my favorites to hear live, but just being able to see them play is a win for me right now, who knows how much longer we can.
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    Old 11-18-2021, 11:54 AM   #1355
    OneSweetMonkey
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Xcacel View Post
    Some fun stats from DMB Society:

    https://images2.imgbox.com/09/f6/jT2i6Zb8_o.jpeg

    Third Verse: Grey Street was the most played song, 26 times in 43 show, so if you were going to a show, you had 60% possibility to hear it. And many people enjoyed that

    Your Favorite : Can’t Stop was played 21 times (!!), which it makes the 3rd most played song (together with Nancies, SMTS and Too Much). Dave was a bit sadistic in this.

    • Windows was the most played encore: 12 times. Really overplayed

    • Seek Up was the top opener. Most people had other expectations, but I can live with that.

    • At the end the Big Three were the three most played albums. 313 songs over 871 total played: 36% of the song played in this tour were from the Big Three.

    • Away From The World was the less played album. More or less 3% of the songs in the tour. Considering that is the second-last album, this is quite surprising. Even Come Tomorrow wasn’t played that much, overall.

    • 120 different songs played in this tour, to me is quite a good rotation. But I don’t know what was the average on previous tours. Of course, we all know that Dreaming Tree was missed in this tour, and maybe this cannot be forgiven.
    Nah. Great song. Great E1 slot. Especially this tour.
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    Old 11-18-2021, 12:08 PM   #1356
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Xcacel View Post
    • At the end the Big Three were the three most played albums. 313 songs over 871 total played: 36% of the song played in this tour were from the Big Three.

    Both a good thing and a bad thing
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    Old 11-18-2021, 12:08 PM   #1357
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Im kind of upset i didnt get to hear Windows this year
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    Old 11-18-2021, 01:55 PM   #1358
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by kelchlsm View Post
    Im kind of upset i didnt get to hear Windows this year
    Absolutely same. Love the song, and really wanted to get it. Hopefully it sticks around because I could see this song going the way of Baby Blue.
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    Old 11-18-2021, 03:27 PM   #1359
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Was lucky enough to hear it and hear it “debut” live at a show, at Raleigh. Dave was completely choked up, mix of emotions of being back playing. He couldn’t even finish it. And it was really something special.
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    Old 11-18-2021, 03:43 PM   #1360
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by OneSweetMonkey View Post
    Nah. Great song. Great E1 slot. Especially this tour.
    I think it's a great song too, just not sure where it fits best. I enjoyed Deer Creek where he played it mid-set and then came out swinging for the encore with Granny in the E1.
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    Old 11-18-2021, 06:08 PM   #1361
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Xcacel View Post
    Some fun stats from DMB Society:

    https://images2.imgbox.com/09/f6/jT2i6Zb8_o.jpeg

    Third Verse: Grey Street was the most played song, 26 times in 43 show, so if you were going to a show, you had 60% possibility to hear it. And many people enjoyed that

    Your Favorite : Can’t Stop was played 21 times (!!), which it makes the 3rd most played song (together with Nancies, SMTS and Too Much). Dave was a bit sadistic in this.

    • Windows was the most played encore: 12 times. Really overplayed

    • Seek Up was the top opener. Most people had other expectations, but I can live with that.

    • At the end the Big Three were the three most played albums. 313 songs over 871 total played: 36% of the song played in this tour were from the Big Three.

    • Away From The World was the less played album. More or less 3% of the songs in the tour. Considering that is the second-last album, this is quite surprising. Even Come Tomorrow wasn’t played that much, overall.

    120 different songs played in this tour, to me is quite a good rotation. But I don’t know what was the average on previous tours. Of course, we all know that Dreaming Tree was missed in this tour, and maybe this cannot be forgiven.
    2013 = 111
    2014 = 107
    2015 = 116
    2016 = 88
    2017 Spring (D&T) = 94
    2018 = 98
    2019 = 97

    So 120 is a lot.
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    Old 11-18-2021, 06:23 PM   #1362
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Cscottrun View Post
    2013 = 111
    2014 = 107
    2015 = 116
    2016 = 88
    2017 Spring (D&T) = 94
    2018 = 98
    2019 = 97

    So 120 is a lot.
    I 100% agree that 120 is a lot but that is pretty heavily padded stat. First off, 8 of those songs are cover songs that were only done once at Gorge just because of Carter/Fonz being absent. Several other songs only done once/twice were also just Dave solos from that weekend so it is hard to give credit to them for those.

    Here is the other stat that kind of sucks, songs that were played but only a few times:

    21 Songs - Played only at 1 Show
    11 Songs - Played only at 2 Show
    8 Songs - Played only at 3 Show
    8 Songs - Played only at 4 Show
    11 Songs - Played only at 5 Show

    59 songs out of the 120 played were played at less than 5 out of the 43 shows.

    That means that there were only 97 performances of those 59 songs out of a possible 871 performances. So, 774 performances were made up of only 61 songs.

    It's amazing that they are willing to play 120 different songs but it would be nice to see them spread out the play time across them a little more evenly.
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    Old 11-18-2021, 06:33 PM   #1363
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Cscottrun View Post
    2013 = 111
    2014 = 107
    2015 = 116
    2016 = 88
    2017 Spring (D&T) = 94
    2018 = 98
    2019 = 97

    So 120 is a lot.
    Worth noting 2021 had 16 cover songs played, mainly because the guests filling in at COVID impacted shows.

    You also need to take into account 2021 had a larger catalog available compared to previous years, so it's hard to judge a tour on just the straight number of songs played. So while the 2021 Summer/Fall Tour had the most different songs ever played in a tour, it was a small fraction of their catalogue compared to previous years.

    I love how DMB Almanac breaks it out on their homepage. They have an amazing post slicing and dicing the tour data in many ways. Here is the snippet about different songs played as a percentage of the catalogue (looks like haven't updated for all of 2021 yet):

    Quote:
    Here are the same tours ranked by total percentage of catalog played (with total played/catalog size and percentage in parentheses):

    1 Summer 1995 (41/55; 74.5%)
    2 Fall 1994 (37/50; 74.0%)
    3 Spring 1994 (34/47; 72.3%)
    4 Summer 2000 (56/78; 71.8%)
    5 Fall 1998 (50/70; 71.4%)
    6 Summer 2003 (68/98; 69.4%)
    7 Fall 1996 (42/61; 68.9%)
    8 Summer 1999 (50/73; 68.5%)
    9 Winter 1995 (34/50; 68.0%)
    10 Winter 1994 (31/47; 66.0%)
    11 Spring/Summer 2001 (61/93; 65.6%)
    12 Spring 1995 (34/53; 64.2%)
    13 Summer 1998 (44/69; 63.8%)
    14 Summer 2015 (116/193; 60.1%)
    T-15 Spring 2002 (57/97; 58.8%)
    T-15 Summer 2013 (110/187; 58.8%)
    17 Summer 2010 (96/166; 57.8%)
    18 Summer 2002 (56/98; 57.1%)
    19 Summer 2006 (72/127; 56.7%)
    20 Summer 2014 (107/189; 56.6%)
    21 Spring 1998 (39/69; 56.5%)
    22 Summer/Fall 2021 (109/216; 55.3%)
    23 Summer 2012 (99/183; 54.1%)
    24 Summer 2004 (56/104; 53.8%)
    25 Summer 2008 (78/146; 53.4%)
    26 Summer 1997 (33/62; 53.2%)
    27 Summer 2007 (71/137; 51.8%)
    28 Summer 2005 (61/120; 50.8%)
    29 International Summer 2009 (78/163; 47.9%)
    30 Summer 2018 (97/204; 47.5%)
    31 Summer 2019 (97/205; 47.3%)
    32 Summer 2016 (88/197; 44.7%)
    33 International Fall 2015 (72/193; 37.3%)
    100% credit to DMB Almanac
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    Old 11-19-2021, 12:47 PM   #1364
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Cscottrun View Post
    2013 = 111
    2014 = 107
    2015 = 116
    2016 = 88
    2017 Spring (D&T) = 94
    2018 = 98
    2019 = 97

    So 120 is a lot.
    Total # of songs misleading because as others have noted a song popping up for a brief period doesn't really mean the tour had good rotation and unique sets. For example 2013 had unique things like the alpine double Halloween closer. Dmb made it abundantly clear nothing unique like that was happening this tour, take your 3rd verse grey Street closer and be happy... same encores rinsed and repeated...

    As far as unique switch ups of sets 2021 was one of the worst. And playing a variety of songs only 1-3 times doesn't keep the overall rotations of sets fresh but will bring up the # of unique songs.
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    Old 11-19-2021, 10:00 PM   #1365
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alpine416 View Post
    As far as unique switch ups of sets 2021 was one of the worst. And playing a variety of songs only 1-3 times doesn't keep the overall rotations of sets fresh but will bring up the # of unique songs.
    This is patently false and is supported by zero statistics. The average show rarity within its own tour - not song count… a number that is: for every show the average song is played once in every ___ shows will show the exact opposite. Keep an eye on almanac homepage.
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    Old 11-19-2021, 10:39 PM   #1366
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    While I think that their total number of songs is misleading bc of Gorge and a few other one-offs, I think this year as a whole was still quite strong and up there with the top tours of the past 10-15 years.

    I’m a big advocate for variety, but I also want less 15+ times played during the tour, and more 5ish times played during a tour, no matter the song. DMB just can’t quite do that bc of the amount of casual fans in attendance vs a band like Phish.

    (I’m not trying to start a stupid DMB bs Phish debate)
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    Old 11-19-2021, 11:08 PM   #1367
    Xcacel
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    the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BruceW View Post
    While I think that their total number of songs is misleading bc of Gorge and a few other one-offs, I think this year as a whole was still quite strong and up there with the top tours of the past 10-15 years.

    I’m a big advocate for variety, but I also want less 15+ times played during the tour, and more 5ish times played during a tour, no matter the song. DMB just can’t quite do that bc of the amount of casual fans in attendance vs a band like Phish.

    (I’m not trying to start a stupid DMB bs Phish debate)

    Maybe I am wrong, but I think they are becoming a bit more lazy in trying new things.
    What I mean:
    • they did the Huey Lewis cover after Jimi, which is cool 1 or 2 times, but then went over it for the rest of the summer.
    • same with Satisfaction cover. They put some effort to arrange it one night in the memory of Charlie Watts, but then they kept on playing quite often. And I know maybe it is not that easy, but they didn’t try to put a solo or a jam in it to make it more special.
    • Sweet outro is delicious but it remained basically unchanged for the whole tour. Same with Seek Up, with the long jazzy chaotic Intro. Same with the Thank You outro in So Damn Lucky: it feels like they set up these arrangements in the rehearsals before the tour, then they sticked with them, and the pure improv jam was reduced to minimum (again, my opinion, and only based on the shows I’ve listened: Bruce and other Ants who attended many shows maybe can prove me wrong).
    • the Gorge weekend surprised me a lot because it was the opposite, it was a sequence of surprises, but mostly because they HAD to. It is like “if they have to do it, they still know how to do it.” Most of the song played those night have a sense of uniqueness, even Dave solo performances are gems.

    I’d like to know if anyone has the same feeling

    Last edited by Xcacel; 11-19-2021 at 11:10 PM.
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    Old 11-19-2021, 11:16 PM   #1368
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Something that’s stood out to me about this past tour is the amount of songs played 20+ times compared to past tours. Only 7 songs were played 20 or more times in 2021, that is low when compared to the other Summer tours.


    Songs played 20+ times

    2021 - 7
    2019 - 13
    2018 - 16
    2016 - 14
    2015 - 14
    2014 - 11
    2013 - 10
    2012 - 8
    2010 - 18
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    Old 11-19-2021, 11:19 PM   #1369
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    That’s true about songs

    I remember when certain versions stood out because the solos were different every night. Now a days every seek up sound the same
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    Old 11-19-2021, 11:21 PM   #1370
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Xcacel View Post
    Maybe I am wrong, but I think they are becoming a bit more lazy in trying new things.
    What I mean:
    • they did the Huey Lewis cover after Jimi, which is cool 1 or 2 times, but then went over it for the rest of the summer.
    • same with Satisfaction cover. They put some effort to arrange it one night in the memory of Charlie Watts, but then they kept on playing quite often. And I know maybe it is not that easy, but they didn’t try to put a solo or a jam in it to make it more special.
    • Sweet outro is delicious but it remained basically unchanged for the whole tour. Same with Seek Up, with the long jazzy chaotic Intro. Same with the Thank You outro in So Damn Lucky: it feels like they set up these arrangements in the rehearsals before the tour, then they sticked with them, and the pure improv jam was reduced to minimum (again, my opinion, and only based on the shows I’ve listened: Bruce and other Ants who attended many shows maybe can prove me wrong).
    • the Gorge weekend surprised me a lot because it was the opposite, it was a sequence of surprises, but mostly because they HAD to. It is like “if they have to do it, they still know how to do it.” Most of the song played those night have a sense of uniqueness, even Dave solo performances are gems.

    I’d like to know if anyone has the same feeling
    Yeah I’d say they have been like that for a long time. The songs/jams will change from tour to tour, but they rarely change from show to show these days. In the 90s that was a different story. That’s not to say it doesn’t still happen on occasion, look at Best of What’s Around this tour. They added a new part to the jam after 30 years of playing it generally the same way (not counting various tempo changes throughout the years). Also Warehouse this year. It started out this tour with a brief “stop-time-intro” and by mid tour they were doing the real stop-time intro complete with crowd “woos” - they also added in Louie Louie at the SPAC show I saw
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    Old 11-20-2021, 03:35 AM   #1371
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    Re: the (2021) summer so far

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Cptn. Monkeyman View Post
    Something that’s stood out to me about this past tour is the amount of songs played 20+ times compared to past tours. Only 7 songs were played 20 or more times in 2021, that is low when compared to the other Summer tours.


    Songs played 20+ times

    2021 - 7
    2019 - 13
    2018 - 16
    2016 - 14
    2015 - 14
    2014 - 11
    2013 - 10
    2012 - 8
    2010 - 18
    I think this may be jaded by the smaller amount of overall shows. Not suggesting you do it but a better indicator would be songs played at over a certain percentage of shows on each tour.
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