Antsmarching.org Forums

Antsmarching.org Forums (http://www.antsmarching.org/forum/index.php)
-   The Tailgate (http://www.antsmarching.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=93)
-   -   The NHL Thread (http://www.antsmarching.org/forum/showthread.php?t=324692)

pathetic 05-27-2020 08:04 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
I agree they all need games. They could’ve done the round robin with current standings. I’m glad hockey is back as well but I’m not a fan of the format. It just takes a guy like Price to get hot and the Canadians to make a run for people to think they need to open up to more teams in the future which really waters down the talent in the playoffs.

aeroshady 05-27-2020 09:00 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pathetic (Post 17714485)
Well aware of how president trophy teams do historically. Definitely some bad takes in here.. so seeding doesnít matter because tampa choked last year and it would be catering to the bruins to let the round robin play out with current point standings over 70 games? Lol got it

Agree with Barbs man, you have the only bad take here. Everyone else seems to get that this is a pandemic and that we could have had no hockey at all. You seem upset because things didnít play out exactly like you would have liked for the Bruins. Btw, I like the Bruins, so Iím really not trying to have a go at them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pathetic (Post 17714499)
I agree they all need games. They couldíve done the round robin with current standings. Iím glad hockey is back as well but Iím not a fan of the format. It just takes a guy like Price to get hot and the Canadians to make a run for people to think they need to open up to more teams in the future which really waters down the talent in the playoffs.

This is a really bad take. They needed to expand the teams because several teams had games at hand. The alternative would have been to not count games that had already been played which would have opened up Pandoraís box of issues with stats.

Also, you would have hated the 1980ís if you donít like ďwatered down playoffs.Ē The majority of teams made it and only like 4 missed back then.

swordo84 05-27-2020 10:04 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Pretty apathetic towards hockey (and all sports) coming back right now. I really don't like that they'll be taking all those tests out of the supply line from those who *actually* need them. I also don't understand their plan - why would you interfere with next season too? Shut it down, call it a year and hope to start fresh sometime in the fall.

aeroshady 05-27-2020 10:21 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by swordo84 (Post 17714574)
Pretty apathetic towards hockey (and all sports) coming back right now. I really don't like that they'll be taking all those tests out of the supply line from those who *actually* need them. I also don't understand their plan - why would you interfere with next season too? Shut it down, call it a year and hope to start fresh sometime in the fall.

So “the hockey guy” on YouTube does a better job at explaining this than I will, but the NHL can’t afford to just shut it down this year. The US market would take too large of a financial hit that it might not come back or take a decade to get on the major networks again like it did after the 2005 lockout.

Basically, we are talking billions of dollars of lost money from US tv deals if the games don’t air. The NHL would owe or not get paid that money. This would create serious escrow issues for the player’s contracts too, I have seen some numbers coming out as high as almost %40 of their contracts. In addition, the NHL would risk losing those tv deals and contracts in the US market. It can not afford to fall behind a league like the MLS and be 5th.

This all also impacts Canada too as money from the US tv deals impacts player contracts along with a lot of other things. With other sports coming back, the NHL has no choice. It has to compete or risk becoming irrelevant down here. 6-7 teams would be at risk of folding.

Again, watch the hockey guy’s YouTube channel to learn more about the in depth issues.

pathetic 05-27-2020 11:55 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by aeroshady (Post 17714528)
Agree with Barbs man, you have the only bad take here. Everyone else seems to get that this is a pandemic and that we could have had no hockey at all. You seem upset because things didnít play out exactly like you would have liked for the Bruins. Btw, I like the Bruins, so Iím really not trying to have a go at them.



This is a really bad take. They needed to expand the teams because several teams had games at hand. The alternative would have been to not count games that had already been played which would have opened up Pandoraís box of issues with stats.

Also, you would have hated the 1980ís if you donít like ďwatered down playoffs.Ē The majority of teams made it and only like 4 missed back then.

:lol:lol

Weíre all happy hockey is back. That doesnít mean the format is good.

If a Meaningless regular season and watered down product is good in your eyes then youíre getting what you want.

barbogast 05-27-2020 05:37 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Seeding doesn’t matter because it’s literally a brand new season for everyone. Tampa choking a year ago has 0 to do with anything. Carey Price could get hot and win the Stanley Cup in any year. Global pandemics don’t fuck everything up every year. This is without doubt the fairest plan if they insist on having a playoffs that has 24 teams. There isn’t a plan in the world that would have all 24 fan bases saying “yep everything about this benefits my club in every way”. Further, all 24 fan bases can surely find at least one thing in this model that they think is unfair. Literally not anything at all to cry about here. I can’t believe this actually needs to be defended.

pathetic 05-27-2020 06:09 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by aeroshady (Post 17714296)
It pretty much does every season. See Tampa for example 1 of this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by barbogast (Post 17715187)
Tampa choking a year ago has 0 to do with anything.

:lol:lol

aeroshady 05-27-2020 06:36 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pathetic (Post 17715217)
:lol:lol

Sorry man, but my point holds. Just because you had a good season and may win the presidents trophy does not automatically mean success in the playoffs. The regular season doesn’t mean that much in hockey compared to other sports. Home ice is not even that much of an advantage any more.

If anything, Tampa last year proves even more why you would want the Bruins to have to play games before the round of 16. This is also just a one year occurrence, and is the best system to get hockey going again. If the Bruins are the best team, they will beat everyone and win. If they lose to the 24th ranked team, they didn’t deserve the cup.

barbogast 05-27-2020 08:44 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pathetic (Post 17715217)
:lol:lol

It’s like talking with a brick wall. Or my toddlers. Jesus

You gonna address anything I actually said or just throw out irrelevant blue bouncing guys?

pathetic 05-27-2020 08:59 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
No one is saying a good season means success in the playoffs. What are you guys missing? The bruins are up 8, 10 and 11 on the other 3 in the conference. They were the best team in hockey until the pandemic. Now they have to re-earn the #1 seed and I’m saying that’s probably not the best way to go about it.

barbogast 05-27-2020 09:07 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pathetic (Post 17715391)
No one is saying a good season means success in the playoffs. What are you guys missing? The bruins are up 8, 10 and 11 on the other 3 in the conference. They were the best team in hockey until the pandemic. Now they have to re-earn the #1 seed and I’m saying that’s probably not the best way to go about it.

I guess I should clarify that I don’t care at all about the presidents trophy discussion that’s happening and don’t understand why it’s relevant

They literally had to do something. What’s the better way to go about it? Again, there’s 0 options where everyone feels like everything is fair and no one has any gripes about anything. What’s the better proposal than this? Honestly I think all teams 1-4 are fucked because 5-12 get real playoff games while 1-4 get bs exhibition games. I understand why the league put some type of stakes in the round robin. What else could they have done?

barbogast 05-27-2020 09:11 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Also, again I’ll say that the idea of needing to play the lowest possible seed for “fairness” is less important this year than ever. Who the fuck knows what any of these teams are going to be like since everyone’s healthy, no one has any chemistry anymore, etc. For all we know it might end up being better to play the Penguins than the Rangers or the Panthers or whoever. Any group of pro athletes can get hot for a month or two. The whole thing is a total fucking crapshoot. That’s the big point I’m trying to make. Who the fuck cares if you’re the one seed or the three seed.

pathetic 05-27-2020 09:25 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
I’d say to have the round robin at current points, even take the points away from the bruins for the games they have in hand and they could lose all 3 games and still have #1 seed. Which means the regular season was meaningless in the format they’re going to play

kev87lads 05-27-2020 09:36 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
A few things. Attempting to be objective:

2019 Tampa has nothing to do with this year

This does seem to be the fairest method they could come up with.

Did the Bruins get screwed? Eh. More complicated than that. Just because they were up 8, 10, and 11 or whatever it was, doesn’t mean they would have been after 82 regular season games. There’s also no guarantee they wouldn’t have been. Obviously we can all play hypotheticals all day about who would or could have finished where. Doesn’t matter. You have angry teams if you don’t do this round robin or something like that. You have teams mad if you just go by whatever the standings were even though equal games weren’t completed.

By being in the top 4 of this selected format, can’t say the regular season didn’t matter.

barbogast 05-27-2020 09:56 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
The most fair thing would have been to go by points percentage and do a standard deal 16 team playoff. That’s pretty much inarguable. I understand why the league and teams didn’t want that. So, this seems like the fairest solution. Nothing is going to be totally fair to everyone.

aeroshady 05-27-2020 10:56 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
I guess I will clarify my Tampa Bay point since it keeps coming up.

My point (or opinion if that makes you feel better): Yes, the regular season this year really doesn’t matter due to Covid-19; that said, saying that the 24 team playoffs and round robin for seeding is unfair because the bruins have to re-earn their top seed shouldn’t matter this year. However, if it really is a sticking point for Bruins fans, my point was that the 2019 Tampa Bay Lightning are proof that seeding doesn’t always matter anyway. I am a true believer that the NHL regular season doesn’t matter that much in the post season other than determining who gets in. I have seen way to many top seeds fail epically to believe having a good regular season matters in the playoffs. Tampa are not the first or last 1 seed they will get bounced early in the NHL playoffs in the past or future.

I think the NHL did a good job in setting something up for this year that works overall. As said in this thread, the season that was played is almost pointless anyway since there has been so much time off and teams will be coming back with different lineups due to injuries.

drakan 05-27-2020 11:27 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
You guys realize that a lot of good teams are in the playoffs right? If your odds are better than 1/16 you are doing good! The presidents trophy team is better but not much better than the next 2 or 3 teams.

~Crashintome89~ 05-28-2020 12:07 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
blololol bruins

Brohan_Santana 05-28-2020 09:11 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Drunk watching the Caps Ď18 run - this was the best timeline

Brohan_Santana 05-28-2020 09:25 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Pretty much every single goal & shot that Penguins series was glove hand on Murray. They werenít even looking when wide open and just went glove high

Brohan_Santana 05-28-2020 09:31 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
I love TJ OSHIE so fucking much

drakan 05-28-2020 10:22 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Yo brohan we are all thinking about your data in the covid thread. Stop in!!

pathetic 05-28-2020 11:08 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by drakan (Post 17715663)
You guys realize that a lot of good teams are in the playoffs right? If your odds are better than 1/16 you are doing good! The presidents trophy team is better but not much better than the next 2 or 3 teams.

You could say that any season. Should they do a round robin every year?

jcc522 05-29-2020 02:40 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
i want to watch live hockey

drakan 05-29-2020 02:44 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
The "bye" teams got really screwed. They have to play 3 tough games against top competition. Should have just went with scrimmages or something. LOL.

Lcsulla 05-30-2020 05:11 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pathetic (Post 17716664)
You could say that any season. Should they do a round robin every year?

Rather unique situation with plenty of teams in the mix for a playoff slot. It is particularly unequal to teams that would high in seeding. If some other team goes on a tear (which we all know can happen - see STL last season) a bubble team could theoretically knock out a frontrunner, happened with a sweep last year so it is not something I can guess on. It also teams with elite players and payoff tested players due to the format that allows guys like Crosby, Ovechkin, Kane, Lundquist )McDavid is elite but not playoff tested really) and a few 'best of the best' players to completely dominate a series and knock off an opponent that is higher seeded if they go on a tear individually and gain momentum for the next matchup - also allows certain teams to benefit from something as simple as a player being cleared to play who likely would not have been in the lineup had the coronovirus shut down sports.

Quote:

Originally Posted by drakan (Post 17717238)
The "bye" teams got really screwed. They have to play 3 tough games against top competition. Should have just went with scrimmages or something. LOL.


Agreed.



Also kind of sucks that these are all considered playoff goals now (assuming having this format happen) - Ovechkin's streak of would have hit 50+ goals in 10 straight seasons because even his most die hard hater knows he would have put 2 more in prior to the playoffs.

barbogast 05-30-2020 08:24 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by drakan (Post 17717238)
The "bye" teams got really screwed. They have to play 3 tough games against top competition. Should have just went with scrimmages or something. LOL.

Disagree. I think itís actually quite beneficial to get your warm up games against top teams. Especially since all involved get through to round two anyway. I still say seeding within the top 4 is being wildly overrated.

barbogast 05-30-2020 08:25 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lcsulla (Post 17717706)
Also kind of sucks that these are all considered playoff goals now (assuming having this format happen) - Ovechkin's streak of would have hit 50+ goals in 10 straight seasons because even his most die hard hater knows he would have put 2 more in prior to the playoffs.

This isnít quite true. Ovie wasnít even close to 10 straight years of 50+. But yeah this sucks

Lcsulla 05-30-2020 09:31 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by barbogast (Post 17718055)
Disagree. I think itís actually quite beneficial to get your warm up games against top teams. Especially since all involved get through to round two anyway. I still say seeding within the top 4 is being wildly overrated.

I like it and hope they start on 7/20 with my Hawks facing the Oilers in a best of 3 which would likely require a week to complete. The Hawks fare well against Edmonton this season - if they could advance to round 2 I will get to watch the Hawks play a postseason series while I am sitting in the middle of the Atlantic ocean on a cruise ship plopped on a bar stool watching the games! That would be great and I have never seen playoff hockey while on a cruise because the normal playoff time is a dud for cruising since all the sloppy drunks, fighters, and assorted annoying people associated with spring break are dumping long island iced teas down their throats from noon until they pass out or get cut off so I almost never book that time of year.

Quote:

Originally Posted by barbogast (Post 17718056)
This isnít quite true. Ovie wasnít even close to 10 straight years of 50+. But yeah this sucks

You are right, I read the article, would have been his tenth 50 goal season, the way it was phrashed I assumed they meant consecutive. My bad, miss hockey - I feel like a junkie must - every few days I have to some hockey/baseball/soccer highlights on my DVD player or Roku.

bradshaw06 05-30-2020 10:03 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
God help any team playing the pens on 8/7. Lol.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:36 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
All trademarks and copyrights are owned by their respective owners. Comments are owned by the poster. The rest is owned by antsmarching.org.