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hailtopitt 12-17-2014 09:24 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
i think watching Brooks Orpik score in a shootout is about as close as we're going to come to seeing pigs fly

barbogast 12-17-2014 09:40 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hailtopitt (Post 15722358)
i think watching Brooks Orpik score in a shootout is about as close as we're going to come to seeing pigs fly

It was a sweet deke move as well. Where the hell did that come from.

hailtopitt 12-17-2014 09:42 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by barbogast (Post 15722375)
It was a sweet deke move as well. Where the hell did that come from.

<333 Brooks <333

Rebecca De Mornay 12-17-2014 09:48 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hailtopitt (Post 15722358)
i think watching Brooks Orpik score in a shootout is about as close as we're going to come to seeing pigs fly

well, what about swine flu (flew)?







i'll show myself out.

Rebecca De Mornay 12-17-2014 09:50 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TMoore4075 (Post 15722019)
A shutout and a loss for Jimmy Howard. Thats so much better than a tie.

the main problem i had with it is it seemed like both teams really stepped off the gas pedal at the end of regulation and at the end of OT.

of course the wings got a little bit of a break by not having to take one last defensive zone faceoff in OT because the refs just let the clock expire.

TMoore4075 12-17-2014 10:18 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebecca De Mornay (Post 15722389)
the main problem i had with it is it seemed like both teams really stepped off the gas pedal at the end of regulation and at the end of OT.

of course the wings got a little bit of a break by not having to take one last defensive zone faceoff in OT because the refs just let the clock expire.

Wings just suck at SO. I think a lot of it is mental and then when you get bad breaks (Nyquist hitting the crossbar) it just creeps in that much more. Add in the fact that two of the games were against divisional opponents and the other (CBJ) in conference. Howard was fantastic, both goalies were really, and he gets a loss on his record because of the shootout. I still can't accept the argument that this is better than ties. I can't imagine any Wings fans who have left the last 3 games at JLA high-fiving saying "that's much better than a tie!"

Rebecca De Mornay 12-17-2014 10:21 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
i mean they would have left feeling that way if they had won.

i personally hate ties, i agree with what lockman said yesterday in that they just need to limit how often we get to a SO by changing OT rules.

I know it will never happen but I'd also much rather see an extra point awarded for a regulation or OT win, then there would be some urgency from the players not to go to a SO either.

hailtopitt 12-17-2014 10:24 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
the thing that screws up the points system is that every game isn't worth the same amount of points (regulation=2pts; OT/SO=3pts)

i don't mind the system the way it is now, but my suggestion would be making every game equal in value

regulation win: 2 points
OT/SO win: 2 points
regulation loss: 0 points
OT/SO loss: 0 points

Rebecca De Mornay 12-17-2014 10:30 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hailtopitt (Post 15722439)
the thing that screws up the points system is that every game isn't worth the same amount of points (regulation=2pts; OT/SO=3pts)

i don't mind the system the way it is now, but my suggestion would be making every game equal in value

regulation win: 2 points
OT/SO win: 2 points
regulation loss: 0 points
OT/SO loss: 0 points

why not...

regulation/OT win: 3 points
SO WIN: 2 points
regulation/OT loss: 0 points
SO loss: 1 point

hailtopitt 12-17-2014 10:32 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebecca De Mornay (Post 15722445)
why not...

regulation/OT win: 3 points
SO WIN: 2 points
regulation/OT loss: 0 points
SO loss: 1 point

1. because i don't think you can separate OT from SO (more so that the NHL never will)

2. because i don't think teams should be rewarded at all for losing

your way is not a horrible way to do it though, just my .02

Rebecca De Mornay 12-17-2014 10:36 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
there's a pretty clear difference between losing playing actual hockey and losing in a SO.

hailtopitt 12-17-2014 10:38 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebecca De Mornay (Post 15722453)
there's a pretty clear difference between losing playing actual hockey and losing in a SO.

edit: nvm read it wrong


yea, maybe...

barbogast 12-17-2014 10:38 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebecca De Mornay (Post 15722445)
why not...

regulation/OT win: 3 points
SO WIN: 2 points
regulation/OT loss: 0 points
SO loss: 1 point

If they did this, we'd have to go back to teams having records like 43-28-6-5. I never liked the four column system.

TMoore4075 12-17-2014 10:42 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebecca De Mornay (Post 15722435)
i mean they would have left feeling that way if they had won.

i personally hate ties, i agree with what lockman said yesterday in that they just need to limit how often we get to a SO by changing OT rules.

I know it will never happen but I'd also much rather see an extra point awarded for a regulation or OT win, then there would be some urgency from the players not to go to a SO either.

yeah they would have been but I don't like games, meaning points in the standings, being decided that way and that's where you are right. yes they need to change something, and I have a feeling 3on3 will be coming. I mean based off the stats earlier when almost half the games that went to OT went to a shootout, and assuming that's still close, they have to do something.

All for the point system for 3 for OT and regulation, 2 for SO win, 1 for an OT or SO loss. The one that was being proposed at one time was 3 for regulation and 2 for OT or shootout and I didn't like that. Sorry an OT win should be worth more than a SO. Can't imagine watching the standings on like the last day and my teams wins in OT only to be leap frogged by a team won won a shootout. But you're right, they won't do it. They like it close.
Quote:

Originally Posted by hailtopitt (Post 15722439)
the thing that screws up the points system is that every game isn't worth the same amount of points (regulation=2pts; OT/SO=3pts)

i don't mind the system the way it is now, but my suggestion would be making every game equal in value

regulation win: 2 points
OT/SO win: 2 points
regulation loss: 0 points
OT/SO loss: 0 points

I still don't like that because you are taking points away from a team because they lost a skills competition. If we got rid of the SO I'd be more willing to go back to this. I mean this is what we had pre the 1999-2000. Back then though, teams would sit back so much worried about losing the point so we had ties a lot. Which lead us to where we are now.

hailtopitt 12-17-2014 10:46 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TMoore4075 (Post 15722460)
I still don't like that because you are taking points away from a team because they lost a skills competition. If we got rid of the SO I'd be more willing to go back to this. I mean this is what we had pre the 1999-2000. Back then though, teams would sit back so much worried about losing the point so we had ties a lot. Which lead us to where we are now.

the bolded is happening already, though

might as well make every game worth the same amount of points if we're going to do that anyway

TMoore4075 12-17-2014 10:53 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hailtopitt (Post 15722469)
the bolded is happening already, though

might as well make every game worth the same amount of points if we're going to do that anyway

Yes but you are taking 1 instead of 2, which can make a difference later in the year. Wings dominated the Leafs last week and at least got a point out of it. Leafs didn't deserve that extra point, let alone to get 2 while the Wings would have gotten 0 because they won a shootout. Again, get rid of the shootout and I would be ok with 0 points for a loss, but you shouldn't be gaining 2 points on your opponent because of a skills competition.

hailtopitt 12-17-2014 10:55 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TMoore4075 (Post 15722484)
Yes but you are taking 1 instead of 2, which can make a difference later in the year. Wings dominated the Leafs last week and at least got a point out of it. Leafs didn't deserve that extra point, let alone to get 2 while the Wings would have gotten 0 because they won a shootout. Again, get rid of the shootout and I would be ok with 0 points for a loss, but you shouldn't be gaining 2 points on your opponent because of a skills competition.

but you aren't....there are 65 minutes of hockey before the shootout

win the game there if you want your points!

Rebecca De Mornay 12-17-2014 10:55 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TMoore4075 (Post 15722484)
Yes but you are taking 1 instead of 2, which can make a difference later in the year. Wings dominated the Leafs last week and at least got a point out of it. Leafs didn't deserve that extra point, let alone to get 2 while the Wings would have gotten 0 because they won a shootout. Again, get rid of the shootout and I would be ok with 0 points for a loss, but you shouldn't be gaining 2 points on your opponent because of a skills competition.

this is a little bit too picky IMO.
you can't create a system that always rewards the team that "deserves" it most, that's the beauty of sports.
If you follow that logic we should just look at Corsi numbers at the end of the game and reward points based on that.

Bron, you in here bro?

bradshaw06 12-17-2014 11:04 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
this mumps thing is getting bad for the pens. they're testing fleury, bortuzzo, and maatta now. the worst part? a bunch of these players went to a childrens hospital a week or so ago and may have infected these kids.

TMoore4075 12-17-2014 11:05 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hailtopitt (Post 15722486)
but you aren't....there are 65 minutes of hockey before the shootout

win the game there if you want your points!

Yeah that's it. I'm sure the Wings, Caps and Bruins just didn't want it enough last night.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebecca De Mornay (Post 15722487)
this is a little bit too picky IMO.
you can't create a system that always rewards the team that "deserves" it most, that's the beauty of sports.
If you follow that logic we should just look at Corsi numbers at the end of the game and reward points based on that.

Bron, you in here bro?

Yes but you know what I mean. But you and I are in agreement with how you TRULY fix it and that's the 3 points for ROW and 2 for a SO win and 1 for an OT/SO loss. That's how you fix it.

TMoore4075 12-17-2014 11:07 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bradshaw06 (Post 15722497)
this mumps thing is getting bad for the pens. they're testing fleury, bortuzzo, and maatta now. the worst part? a bunch of these players went to a childrens hospital a week or so ago and may have infected these kids.

It's getting pretty scary.

Rebecca De Mornay 12-17-2014 11:07 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bradshaw06 (Post 15722497)
this mumps thing is getting bad for the pens. they're testing fleury, bortuzzo, and maatta now. the worst part? a bunch of these players went to a childrens hospital a week or so ago and may have infected these kids.

jesus that would be horrible.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMoore4075 (Post 15722501)
Yes but you know what I mean. But you and I are in agreement with how you TRULY fix it and that's the 3 points for ROW and 2 for a SO win and 1 for an OT/SO loss. That's how you fix it.

ya totally agree with that.

TMoore4075 12-17-2014 11:13 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebecca De Mornay (Post 15722504)
ya totally agree with that.

Sadly we'll have to deal with (most likely) 3on3, which is better than nothing because they'll never do the point system. Even if it only creates moderate separation of those last few playoff contenders, the NHL doesn't want that. They want the Las Vegas Black Nights to have a shot on the last day....ugh can't believe I said that.

bradshaw06 12-17-2014 11:14 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TMoore4075 (Post 15722503)
It's getting pretty scary.

How the staff thought it was a good idea to let crosby be around after seeing his face, i'll never know. totally foolish.

TMoore4075 12-17-2014 11:15 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bradshaw06 (Post 15722515)
How the staff thought it was a good idea to let crosby be around after seeing his face, i'll never know. totally foolish.

The medical staff was getting shit last year too weren't they? And yeah totally agree. I mean he looked like a cartoon character after they get punched.

hailtopitt 12-17-2014 11:24 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TMoore4075 (Post 15722501)
Yeah that's it. I'm sure the Wings, Caps and Bruins just didn't want it enough last night.

no, i'm just saying the shootout has been around for what, a decade now? same rules for every team. penguins practice the shootout after every practice for the last 6-7 years or so. once it's part of the game you have to adjust. i'm sure if the wings were dominant in the shootouts you might feel differently

i get that it's not "real hockey" and that a skills competition awards extra points. it sucks that it has to be that way, but honestly its a measure that limits injuries, is exciting for fans and eliminates ties. it's really not a bad system in place

bradshaw06 12-17-2014 11:30 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TMoore4075 (Post 15722518)
The medical staff was getting shit last year too weren't they? And yeah totally agree. I mean he looked like a cartoon character after they get punched.

i think after sid had the broken neck/concussion the whole medical staff was let go. this staff doesnt seem much better.

TMoore4075 12-17-2014 11:56 AM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hailtopitt (Post 15722524)
no, i'm just saying the shootout has been around for what, a decade now? same rules for every team. penguins practice the shootout after every practice for the last 6-7 years or so. once it's part of the game you have to adjust. i'm sure if the wings were dominant in the shootouts you might feel differently

i get that it's not "real hockey" and that a skills competition awards extra points. it sucks that it has to be that way, but honestly its a measure that limits injuries, is exciting for fans and eliminates ties. it's really not a bad system in place

If the Wings dominated would I feel differently? I wouldn't be as pissy as I am now, but still wouldn't want shootouts. I've never wanted shootouts. Ties never bothered me. Last nights game between the Wings and Jackets was exactly where a tie is where it should have ended. Both teams over the entire game were pretty even and both goalies were amazing. Your argument about everyone has to deal with it and it's been around, can go the other way too. Ties were around forever so why get rid of them? Everyone had to deal with the foot in the crease rule but they realized it's faults, sadly not quick enough, and fixed it. I was at one of the first 4on4 OT games for the Wings and it was against the Stars. Was exciting, an amazing game, and I didn't leave upset that someone didn't win. I loved the game I was just at. Would I have rather the Wings lose in a SO or walk away with a tie that was exiting to watch against a conference opponent and the defending Cup champs? No. Shootouts have become more common placed than I think even the NHL originally had intended. Maybe they thought what you thought and thought the teams would go harder in regulation or OT to avoid it. The thing is, with 3 minutes to go, most teams will play it amazingly safe to salvage the point. That's where no matter what you do, teams will do the best for self preservation. Even if you got rid of points for an ot loss, I think teams would play it safe in the hopes they'd get lucky in a shootout rather than get cause in an odd-man rush late in OT.

They NHL could make it better overall with a different point system. It would be more equitable and maybe get teams to try and avoid the shootout. Doesn't hurt teams for trying to go for it either as they'd still get something out of it. Doesn't get rid of the shootouts for the fans that like that or think it's necessary.

hailtopitt 12-17-2014 12:02 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
i guess where we really differ is that i hate ties, i'm glad they're gone

i guess i wouldn't hate 3v3 but adding more than an extra 5 mins on top of the 60 in regulation is where injuries start creeping up and fatigue starts bleeding into upcoming games for teams that have a long stretch of OTs

dmbetc 12-17-2014 01:22 PM

Re: The NHL Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hailtopitt (Post 15722570)
i guess where we really differ is that i hate ties, i'm glad they're gone

i guess i wouldn't hate 3v3 but adding more than an extra 5 mins on top of the 60 in regulation is where injuries start creeping up and fatigue starts bleeding into upcoming games for teams that have a long stretch of OTs

Then find a way to win it in regulation. It's done in the playoffs, where fatigue and injuries are more detrimental to the team. I don't like ties and I don't mind shootouts, but would rather a 4v4, then a 5 min 3v3 type deal.

It could make for some long games..but (and I know comparing different sports to hockey is silly) baseball does it. They have long ass games and turn around and play the next day.


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