Re: The NHL Thread
 

Come on Sharks!!!!!!!!!!

Please get it done so I can go back to watching Hockey.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Haha because you don't want to face him or actually medically concerned? Listening to all the interviews of him and Cooper throughout the playoffs it sounds like they've been pretty cautious and safe with everything. I don't think they'd throw him out there if he were at risk. He's been on the ice for most every practice since the ECF began.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Can't speak for H2P, but...

:lol No, not that.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

i'm concerned for his health...hockey is always secondary to health...he is a great player and i want to see him play for years to come

if there's any fan base that understands the seriousness and volatility of blood clots, it's penguins fans

so no, it has nothing to do with "facing him"...i think the lightning would be worse off with him at this point...not in game shape, rusty and at risk for complications

Re: The NHL Thread
 

yea, that was kind of insulting TBH

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Obviously health comes first, which is what he and the staff have been saying constantly the past month or so. Which is why if we see him I would think it would mean they think he's ready to go.

I was just asking the question. With regards to rust, maybe, but with a player of his caliber I'd think any contribution he can give would be worth having. Stralman missed more time than he has and contributed right away since he's come back. I certainly don't think they'd be worse off getting one of the top goal scorers in the league back, especially for the PP which has been a bit lacking in this series.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Yeah don't put him in. It's easy for me on the outside to say and not have the pressure of trying to win a Cup but you're 26 and have your whole life ahead of you.

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It wasn't really meant as an insult? If Crosby or Malkin were out for most of this series and then we're coming back for game 7 I would be a bit concerned about what getting that quality of a player back may add to the team.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

All joking aside, I don't think it's a good idea from a health perspective or a hockey perspective. Is what ever a rusty Stamkos could provide worth taking that risk (and there would be rust. See Fleury, Marc-Andre)? TB has clearly shown they can hang with and best the Pens.

Not worth it, IMO.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

:lol :lol :lol :lol

I honestly considered putting the Flyers and Penns boxes back in the truck and if anyone ever figured it out I was gonna be like :confused:confused go Caps!

Re: The NHL Thread
 

So not a fan of my MAF idea? :)

I agree with you that he would be a bit rusty and could easily make a costly error but if he did play a couple of shifts and contributed even an assist to help TB win that would be a huge story for the NHL.

Not sure they could play much worse than the first 40 minutes. :lol

I know all about blood thinners, I was on them for months following my heart surgery - every damn time I would just nick my leg against a table or something and not even realize I broke the skin until there was blood running down my leg soaking my sock and pooling in my sneaker. There is simply nothing you can do to stop the bleeding until you can get to a first aid kit with bandages and tape. The only alternative I can see that is feasible would be aspirin, it has been 8 years since my surgery and I still have to take one a day t o thin my blood out. In the end I expect Stamkos to do what is right for himself and the team and TB will be fine with whatever decision he makes.

If I was a Penguins fan I would not want to see him in the game either. Even if he only played a handful of short shifts per period he is capable of providing a spark for TB at any time.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Malkin has been out for most the series hasn't he?

I think the addition of Stamkos probably outweighs the possible detriments for TB as far as gamesmanship, rink rust, etc, is concerned.

I just hope that the allure of the Finals doesn't make him risk his long-term health.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

As for Stamkos, I wouldn't put him in either. It's not smart health wise and the Bolts can clearly get it done without him. Not worth it. Even if it means he never plays in a Lightning jersey again. Health first, always.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Stralman hasn't been that good....

and yea, maybe he helps on the PP but there's a distinct possibility that he doesn't help....that's a big risk in a game 7

i think it would hurt them. they've been rolling with 7 D and playing well without him. a big shake up in a game 7 on the road sounds like a bad idea from both a hockey and a health standpoint

Crosby, yes, you should be concerned because Crosby is a step above Stamkos talent-wise

but if Malkin was out for 2 months with blood clot problems and was trying to come back for a game 7, i'd be advocating that he sit. and if i was the opponent i'd be begging him to play

Re: The NHL Thread
 

I agree with all of this. If TB can find a safe way to get him some ice time why not give it a shot. Maybe he is the spark they need to get back to the finals or he could turn over a puck and end up blowing their shot. Who knows.

The other thing I would be curious about is how the Penguins would treat him on the ice. I do not believe for one moment that that would try and hurt him but they could be a little hamstrung trying NOT to hurt him.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Yeah absolutely, I don't want him out there if it jeopardizes his long term health.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

He's been fine, not stellar but certainly not detracting, and scored a goal in his first game back.

And I'm operating under the assumption that if they put him on the ice then he is medically okay and him and the staff don't have any lingering concerns. As they've been advocating all postseason long that his health is the primary concern.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

:lol Stralman hasn't been fine...if you consider a -4 and getting absolutely embarrassed by Crosby last night "fine" then ok...good for him scoring a goal in his 1st game back. thats great, but hes had a bad series along with most of Tampa's blue line

and yea, if Stamkos is 100% cleared to play then fine, i just don't buy it.

The NHL Thread
 

As you just said, the defense hasn't been very good as a whole. And +/- isn't the end all be all of defining characteristics of someone's play. There are 5 other players on the ice that can contribute to that.

But yeah Stralman was the only player Crosby undressed last night. You're right they probably shouldn't play Stralman anymore. Sit him down.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Everything I say though just has to be a confrontation with you doesn't it HP? We probably shouldn't acknowledge one another anymore because literally anytime I post you just start talking down on me and shitting on anything I have to say.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

+/- is a good indication of effectiveness and Stralman hasn't been effective. you said he missed more time than Stamkos but "contributed right away". thats just wrong...he has 1 goal, is constantly getting burned and out of position and is a -4....that's not contributing to me

and i never said anything about sitting him...but you can't just make false blanket statements and expect not to get any push back

i get that the Lightning are your team, but you gotta be impartial if you want to do true analysis

The NHL Thread
 

Scoring a goal in his first game back was contributing right away. It's pretty much the definition. And yes +/- is one way we have to measure effectiveness but it doesn't account for the play of the other players on the ice at that time. It's a very broad statistic.

My point is him coming back off a broken leg and missing more time than Stamkos has, he's played relatively well, he's been fine. Relative to a whole defense has played poorly, they all need to play better. Would you say getting him back has hurt Tampa? Which was the point of the discussion about players coming back from injury? Would they have been in a better position without him playing? No, I don't think they would have. And getting Stamkos back in game 7, assuming he's 100% ready to go, is something I'd welcome. Nothing they have been saying this postseason would leave me to believe they'd play him otherwise. But I know, "you just don't buy that". What you'd need to "buy" it is beyond me.

I'm not being irrationally biased and claiming he's been stellar just because I'm a Lightning fan.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Ehhh

Debatable

Re: The NHL Thread
 

I agree. It's too broad and accounts for more than just an individual players' play.

Good hockey statistical analysis is very far behind the other major sports right now, especially in terms of availability to the public and fans. There's not many efficiency statistics that I know of that are available, and maybe that's my own deficiency. But I think over the next few years that's going to start to change.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

+/- is tough. It can be valuable when you are combining it with other factors, but you've got to be careful that you're not basing your judgement of a player's two way ability solely on that one stat.

I mean, just in a game I played last week I blocked three shots on one shift, including one that was going into an open net, but BAM, failed clearing attempt by my partner, quick shot from the point, puck deflects off a guy's butt and in. Minus 1 for me after what I considered a pretty solid shift.

Later in the period, line change and I hop over the boards. Two seconds later, we score. I did absolutely nothing on the play. Plus 1. Woo hoo!

So yeah, it's a stat that can contribute to the overall evaluation of a player, but it shouldn't be viewed in a vacuum.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Don't take it personal, it's just how H2P talks hockey. Once I realized that, he and I have actually <gasp> agreed on a couple things.
I've always been a believer in the idea that the best way to analyze hockey and its players is just to watch it.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Yeah I wasn't saying its a crap statistic, and clearly if you get into that minus 3, 4, 5 range your play probably needs to pick up in some way. But it isn't the end all evaluator of how someone is playing.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Yeah I wasn't saying its a crap statistic, and clearly if you get into that minus 3, 4, 5 range your play probably needs to pick up in some way. But it isn't the end all evaluator of how someone is playing.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

Yeah h2p gets a little excited sometimes but he knows his shit. Great hockey head on that dude.

Eye test, ftw. Totally agree. I can learn everything I need to know about teams and players from watching them over a period of time. Fancy stats have their place, but also my opinion that the eye test is where we can learn the most.

Re: The NHL Thread
 

http://lightning.nhl.com/club/app?se...plusMinus&pg=2

He's also only -2, as are Drouin and Callahan, I bet you think both of them have been awful this series as well? Drouin's had a few bad turnovers but has also been a great contributor on offense.