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-   -   The NHL Thread (https://www.antsmarching.org/forum/showthread.php?t=324692)

lockman21 11-12-2013 10:15 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bron Yr Aur (Post 14910043)
$2m per seem a bit high? Maybe not.

Either way, has there been anyone picked in the 3rd round or later that has been as successful as Andrew Shaw so far in his career? Talk about a steal in that draft in the 5th round.

And the Hawks got Saad in the 2nd round that year. Damn good draft for the Hawks.

Yes. Lots and lots of them have been more successful.

Ryan Miller, Dustin Byfuglien, Pavel Datsyuk, Jamie Benn, Jonathan Quick, Pekka Rinne, Henrik Lundqvist, Daniel Alfredsson, Matt Moulson, Keith Yandle, Tim Thomas, Henrik Zetterberg...

And that's just off the top of my head. Lots of those guys were drafted in the 7th, 8th, and 9th rounds.

That's not to take anything away from Shaw. He's far exceeded expectations, but he's far from the most successful late round pick and far from being the only one.

But yes, having picks like 5th rounders end up successful is really key to becoming a perennial contender.

And I'm a fan of the $2 million per for Shaw. The cap is going to skyrocket the next two years. It's right around where him and Bickell should be.

TMoore4075 11-12-2013 10:24 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Zetterberg...210th overall. Haha. Not bad for a Conn Smythe winner.

Bron Yr Aur 11-12-2013 10:30 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lockman21 (Post 14910084)
Yes. Lots and lots of them have been more successful.

Ryan Miller, Dustin Byfuglien, Pavel Datsyuk, Jamie Benn, Jonathan Quick, Pekka Rinne, Henrik Lundqvist, Daniel Alfredsson, Matt Moulson, Keith Yandle, Tim Thomas, Henrik Zetterberg...

And that's just off the top of my head. Lots of those guys were drafted in the 7th, 8th, and 9th rounds.

That's not to take anything away from Shaw. He's far exceeded expectations, but he's far from the most successful late round pick and far from being the only one.

But yes, having picks like 5th rounders end up successful is really key to becoming a perennial contender.

And I'm a fan of the $2 million per for Shaw. The cap is going to skyrocket the next two years. It's right around where him and Bickell should be.

Oops, I meant in the 3rd round or later in the 2011 draft.

And that's not to say he will be the best player picked in the 3rd or later that year, but so far has been most successful.

lockman21 11-12-2013 11:23 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TMoore4075 (Post 14910107)
Zetterberg...210th overall. Haha. Not bad for a Conn Smythe winner.

Thanks for reminding me why I hate Detroit so much. :lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bron Yr Aur (Post 14910119)
Oops, I meant in the 3rd round or later in the 2011 draft.

And that's not to say he will be the best player picked in the 3rd or later that year, but so far has been most successful.

Ah, yeah.

Well, in all fairness, it usually takes a couple years for those late round picks to develop. Shaw is a little bit of an exception. Look no further than Niklas Hjalmarsson. Drafted in the 4th round in 2005. It took until the 2008-2009 playoffs before he really made his mark. So that would be the equivalent of the 2014-2015 playoffs for the guys drafted in 2011.

Shaw is a rare breed for sure. We're probably seeing his ceiling right now, but that's not a bad thing. He'll likely be a grinder his whole career, and he knows that. I'm very happy with the signing. As I said, we're probably seeing his ceiling, so a long term deal to watch him "develop" really doesn't make sense, and a relatively small cap hit.

Interesting that it came mid-season like this though.

bonzo48280 11-12-2013 11:30 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
the Hawks may never go to free agency again...at least for a major signing. Stan Bowman said recently that if it was up to him he would never go to free agency again. theo said the same thing about the Cubs. It's the way of the world now.

TMoore4075 11-12-2013 11:34 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bonzo48280 (Post 14910247)
the Hawks may never go to free agency again...at least for a major signing. Stan Bowman said recently that if it was up to him he would never go to free agency again. theo said the same thing about the Cubs. It's the way of the world now.

Wouldn't surprise me. This is the first year the Wings did any kind of major signing since 2008 when they signed Hossa to the one year deal. After that they had signed all the key guys to long contracts so didn't have the contracts expiring to be able to sign big names. Which isn't bad cause you'd rather never have to worry about your big names again. Also the rest of the league is doing the same. Ducks knew they couldn't replace Perry and Getzlaf so they signed them. So that leaves a bidding war for the 2nd tier guys and the smart GM's will try their best to not get pulled into that. Either find the right guy or let the kids play.

lockman21 11-12-2013 03:47 PM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bonzo48280 (Post 14910247)
the Hawks may never go to free agency again...at least for a major signing. Stan Bowman said recently that if it was up to him he would never go to free agency again. theo said the same thing about the Cubs. It's the way of the world now.

Trades and drafting. And also trading for draft picks. That's the way to build a powerhouse.

aicdmb 11-12-2013 04:31 PM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Cant believe Stamkos.....fuckin A

rickyh24 11-12-2013 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bonzo48280 (Post 14910247)
the Hawks may never go to free agency again...at least for a major signing. Stan Bowman said recently that if it was up to him he would never go to free agency again. theo said the same thing about the Cubs. It's the way of the world now.

Yeah cubs are really on to something.

lockman21 11-12-2013 06:00 PM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyh24 (Post 14910881)
Yeah cubs are really on to something.

:lol :lol :lol

dmbetc 11-12-2013 07:09 PM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Welcome to offensive hockey, Flyers!

~Crashintome89~ 11-12-2013 07:22 PM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
ah, the offense is finally showing its teeth.

I hope there is a little left over for tomorrow night's game against the Pens.

lockman21 11-12-2013 07:24 PM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Btw, I know how some Hawks fans loved Stalberg...

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports...ators/3246173/

He's a healthy scratch multiple times in Nashville.

The dude is a fast version of Jack Skille.

Bron Yr Aur 11-12-2013 08:08 PM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Still would rather have Stalberg than Bickell for their respective contracts. Bickell is shitty.

DynastyDrummer1 11-13-2013 12:16 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Sabres!!!!! First home win of the season!!!!

And Quick is hurt? Didn't hear how bad it was on the postgame.....

dmbetc 11-13-2013 12:24 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
If Quick is out for awhile (doubt it) Kings should make a trade for Miller.

DynastyDrummer1 11-13-2013 01:08 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dmbetc (Post 14911370)
If Quick is out for awhile (doubt it) Kings should make a trade for Miller.

I think he'll be fine. Maybe miss a game or two tops. He looked like he wanted to stay in. Before he got the whistle and the trainer came out, the puck was down in the Sabres defensive zone and Quick was down on the ice stretching, so he knew something was up. It didn't look that serious though, he skated off the ice on his own if I remember correctly.

unccrombie 11-13-2013 04:33 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dmbetc (Post 14911370)
If Quick is out for awhile (doubt it) Kings should make a trade for Miller.

Why would you want two #1 goalies, even if it was 2+ months? I highly doubt Miller would sign up for that.

fonzz41 11-13-2013 06:46 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lockman21 (Post 14911090)
Btw, I know how some Hawks fans loved Stalberg...

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports...ators/3246173/

He's a healthy scratch multiple times in Nashville.

The dude is a fast version of Jack Skille.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bron Yr Aur (Post 14911170)
Still would rather have Stalberg than Bickell for their respective contracts. Bickell is shitty.

Stalberg makes me sad. It's like he woke up one morning with ridiculously good hockey skills, but had no idea how to play hockey. He's a great skater and has a decent shot, but has no sense for positioning, when to shoot/pass, or how to play a physical game. He either holds on to the puck too long or gets rid of it like it's a game of hot potato, and overall just seems lost many shifts.

I thought maybe it was just Chicago's system and that a change would do him some good, but after watching the NSH/COL game last week, I realized he looks exactly the same - if not worse. And that makes me sad.

cry_minarets458 11-13-2013 06:58 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Poor Stamkos. USA's future silver medal is now more embarrassing as Canada is missing a key piece.


....

swordo84 11-13-2013 07:55 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
WTF Buffalo? WTF?

I can understand a shake-up, but why are you going with an "interm" coach?

CrushLive 11-13-2013 08:04 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by swordo84 (Post 14911708)
WTF Buffalo? WTF?

I can understand a shake-up, but why are you going with an "interm" coach?

the interim title is a little frustrating but i'll take it. regier needed to go (a few years ago) and rolston had no business being in the NHL.

great to see Nolan back with the Sabres.

dmbetc 11-13-2013 08:06 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by unccrombie (Post 14911404)
Why would you want two #1 goalies, even if it was 2+ months? I highly doubt Miller would sign up for that.

I was .1% serious! Although, he'd probably like that more than playing for Buffalo. :)

swordo84 11-13-2013 08:09 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CrushLive (Post 14911724)
the interim title is a little frustrating but i'll take it. regier needed to go (a few years ago) and rolston had no business being in the NHL.

great to see Nolan back with the Sabres.

I can see why they are doing it (let new gm pick his guy), but why not just hire Pat Lafontaine today and let him do his thing. In a month, he can have his new GM picked out, who would then hire his coach and THEN have your big shake-up. Hate the inconsistencies the players now have to deal with. I see this getting worse before it gets better.

TMoore4075 11-13-2013 08:12 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CrushLive (Post 14911724)
the interim title is a little frustrating but i'll take it. regier needed to go (a few years ago) and rolston had no business being in the NHL.

great to see Nolan back with the Sabres.

Hope he doesn't get screwed over again.

fonzz41 11-13-2013 08:28 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Cool to see Nolan back. Team will still suck, but maybe they will actually play like professionals a little itty bit.

DynastyDrummer1 11-13-2013 08:45 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
YES!!!! Good riddance Darcy!!!

I'm drinking early today

bonzo48280 11-13-2013 09:16 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyh24 (Post 14910881)
Yeah cubs are really on to something.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lockman21 (Post 14910927)
:lol :lol :lol

the Cubs went from a bottom 5 farm system to a top 5 (and some say top 3) farm system in 2 seasons and have 3 top 10-15 prospects and 6-7 top 30 prospects in Baseball.

You're right, they are onto something.

swordo84 11-13-2013 09:19 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bonzo48280 (Post 14911945)
the Cubs went from a bottom 5 farm system to a top 5 (and some say top 3) farm system in 2 seasons and have 3 top 10-15 prospects and 6-7 top 30 prospects in Baseball.

You're right, they are onto something.

Farm teams and prospects do not win you championships. Blue Jays had the #1 farm system last (maybe two years ago) year. Look at where they are.

Baseball prospects are the biggest unknown out of all pro sports.

bonzo48280 11-13-2013 09:23 AM

Re: The NHL 2013-14 Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by swordo84 (Post 14911955)
Farm teams and prospects do not win you championships. Blue Jays had the #1 farm system last (maybe two years ago) year. Look at where they are.

Baseball prospects are the biggest unknown out of all pro sports.

The Cardinals and Red Sox have both been to multiple World Series over the last decade and compete (nearly) every year, while teams like the yankees and angels sign free agents and it goes nowhere.

the point is that you build a championship through the draft and development, not free agency. the Red Sox, Cardinals, Packers, and Blackhawks are all testaments to that.


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