Man Of Steel 2/Superman vs Batman (2015)

[Jake]

MARTHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



just wanted to throw that out there

[TwoStep2888]

Amazon had the Ultimate bluray on sale for 8.99 so I bought it, should get here this week

[iMAC386]

The Ultimate version is still fucking cheesy. The extra scenes dont redeem the bad acting or poor script.

They're trying to execute this comic book feel to the movie, which has the potential to be really cool, but it's so poorly and inartfully executed. Makes the Nolan movies seem like the way they should have gone with this series since these just aren't working.

[Gene Parmesan]

I enjoyed it. My only gripe is the Martha thing. Pretty stupid way to resolve the title of the movie.

"Wait, his mom has the same name as my mom? I love my mom. Let's stop this fight to the death and be friends.."

[BotheLaneFan]

Originally Posted by Jake

MARTHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



just wanted to throw that out there

Shoulda got Tom Waits. He would have solved this problem way earlier.

[M. Steng]

Originally Posted by Gene Parmesan

I enjoyed it. My only gripe is the Martha thing. Pretty stupid way to resolve the title of the movie.

"Wait, his mom has the same name as my mom? I love my mom. Let's stop this fight to the death and be friends.."

Not that I'm in any position to try to convince anybody to like something I like, and I'm more than willing to accept a difference of opinion, but I think Kev and I did a decent job of summarizing the importance of the "Martha" moment a few months ago in this thread:

Originally Posted by KevinTH

I won't lie and say I don't get why some may feel the "Martha" scene didn't play out well, but it worked for me. I do get it, but knowing the history of Bruce Wayne and being as close to the character as I am it resonated with me. I do think people aren't looking into the scene as deeply as it was intended, and thus they lose sight of the point and it just comes off as "silly". I just think that it was an interesting view into the soul of Bruce Wayne, and what drives him. I think it also shows a unique innocence that I don't think we're too familiar with seeing in most iterations of Bruce. Ultimately Bruce Wayne was pushed into becoming Batman due to the loss of his parents. Right, we all know that. But what does that do to a person? What did that do to a 10-11 year old boy, to see his parents violently murdered in front of him? How does that affect his psyche and growth as a man? Something that's often overlooked is that Bruce is somewhat psychotic. For someone to be so inclined to dress up as a BAT and run around taking the law into his own hands, I'm inclined to think there's a mental instability there. On top of that, when something happens that's as traumatic as witnessing your parent's murder, I'm not a doctor, but my guess is that halts someone's growth a bit. What makes Batman so compelling, and why he resonates with so many people, is because he is just a man. Bruce is driven by the death of his parents, and hearing his mother's name and reacting the way he did just shows how broken he is as a man. When he hears that name he ceases to be Batman and reverts to a childlike innocence that can only be found in Bruce Wayne the man. It humanizes him. This in turn strengthens his redemption and push to do right by Clark/Superman upon his death.

Originally Posted by M. Steng

Right, and you have to remember, this is Bruce at his absolute breaking point. He's been fighting crime in Gotham for twenty (20!) years. That's a long time to work tirelessly and still feel like you haven't made any progress. "Weeds are like criminals, Alfred; you pull one up, another one grows in its place." He's worn down. He's broken. And the advent of a being who could destroy the world and who has no accountability makes him feel pathetic and small and like his war on crime has been meaningless.

He's tried to do the right thing. He's tried to abide by his code, and none of it has mattered. He's on the brink of losing everything he's held onto as "diamond absolutes" since his parents were killed. His anger is totally misdirected at Superman, but he's convinced himself that this will be his legacy- saving the world from a destructive force that cannot be held to any standards.

But in that moment, the most crucial moment of the film, Bruce is about to commit absolute murder in the truest sense of the word. Sure, he took out some bad guys in other parts of the film; but that killing was no more or less tangential or collateral than it had been in every other Batman movie to date (yes- Batman kills in the Nolan trilogy). But here he will, with his own hands, stab someone in the heart and go past the line he drew in the sand 20 years ago. But right as he's about to step past that line in the sand, he hears the name Martha- coincidentally, the name that is shared by both of the two heroes' mothers. It triggers an emotional response that brings him back to the very moment that spawned his whole war on crime- his father's last living spoken word- his mother's name. It brings him back to reality, makes him pause to think of the thing that made him into the man he had become. It not only makes him realize that what he is about to do will be the end of his time as Batman, but it also forces him to realize that Clark is a person all his own, with a family and loved ones and real ties to this planet.

I've said it before, but it's the most powerful moment in any Batman movie or comic book I've ever read, rivaled only with the scene in The Dark Knight where Bruce sits with the cowl in his lap following Rachel's death.

[DMBzilla]

Martha scene was dumb as shit.

[kelchlsm]

Saw it for the 1st time on HBO this past weekend. Basically watched it to see Ben Affleck's Batman for the solo movie coming out and thought he did a pretty good at it.

Other than that, the movie was OK- just never really want to see it again.

[RainDog1980]

I guess I don't understand what people were really expecting from this movie. I had none going in, don't know the direct source material, etc., and I thought it was decent. I do agree it resolved pretty easily, but I got it, as outlined above.

What I did find unfortunate is that my point of reference for a Zack Snyder comic movie was Watchmen, and I thought that was fantastic. I nearly shit myself when Manhattan ended Rorschach, and really cared about the characters. This, I only cared because I knew who they were already.

Gal Gadot was pretty awesome as WW, though. Really liked her expressiveness at the final fight.

[KevinTH]

Originally Posted by M. Steng

Not that I'm in any position to try to convince anybody to like something I like, and I'm more than willing to accept a difference of opinion, but I think Kev and I did a decent job of summarizing the importance of the "Martha" moment a few months ago in this thread:

Damn, those were great reads.

[DeuceStep]

The Martha thing was dumb. Batman had this woefully executed plan due to Superman directly and indirectly killing scores of people and then forgot all about that as soon as Superman utters mommy's name. Two powerful superhero figures with mommy issues, unbelievable.

I also hate Amy Adams. Worst Lois Lane ever. Like the Man of Steel is going to go for that skim milk white bread. Amy Adams does not reflect the fly-as-fuck persona of Lois Lane.

[TwoStep2888]

I really liked the Martha thing

[bradshaw06]

The martha thing was really bad. But what was worse to me was the whole double dream thing bruce had. Especially the flash part.

[TwoStep2888]

the dream sequences were something that I intend to pay more attention to when I watch Ultimate blu ray, as I was a bit lost on them when I saw it in theaters

[M. Steng]

Originally Posted by RainDog1980

I guess I don't understand what people were really expecting from this movie. I had none going in, don't know the direct source material, etc., and I thought it was decent. I do agree it resolved pretty easily, but I got it, as outlined above.

What I did find unfortunate is that my point of reference for a Zack Snyder comic movie was Watchmen, and I thought that was fantastic. I nearly shit myself when Manhattan ended Rorschach, and really cared about the characters. This, I only cared because I knew who they were already.

Gal Gadot was pretty awesome as WW, though. Really liked her expressiveness at the final fight.

Watchmen truly is a great film, one of the first movies I ever watched that totally wowed me. I'd never seen a movie made in that visual style before. It's still a good rewatch every now and again.

[chadizzy1]

Jake -

DC posted this for you today

https://www.facebook.com/dccomics/po...297567778485:0

[TwoStep2888]

I liked BvS a lot, but I would have liked to see Snyder take on a MoS 2 without all the clutter of the shared universe

[fridge112887]

Originally Posted by TwoStep2888

I liked BvS a lot, but I would have liked to see Snyder take on a MoS 2 without all the clutter of the shared universe

I'm still hopeful for Matthew Vaughn

[TwoStep2888]

Originally Posted by fridge112887

I'm still hopeful for Matthew Vaughn

yeah hopefully WB/DC doesn't fumble around with it too much

[M. Steng]

I too thought of Jake and all the haters and doubters, of which there are many, when I saw that post. Still clueless!

[chadizzy1]

Originally Posted by M. Steng

I too thought of Jake and all the haters and doubters, of which there are many, when I saw that post. Still clueless!

For some reason, I read this in Trump's voice.

[M. Steng]

Originally Posted by chadizzy1

For some reason, I read this in Trump's voice.

(that was the idea)

[chadizzy1]

Originally Posted by chadizzy1

Affleck, really. Really?

There are so many better actors. Ugh.

I was re reading the page from where Affleck was announced:
https://www.antsmarching.org/forum/s...php?p=14791653



But, I was pleasantly surprised that he did a great job in the role.

[sheldonlevene]

Originally Posted by sheldonlevene

People will pull the Ledger and Hathaway cards, however this is not a Nolan casting I don't think. Affleck is just a bad choice. I can't wait to see how it turns out...I'll still see the film, but this does nothing to get me amped up for summer 2015.

Quoting myself from back then .

I was definitely in the "this is going to be brutal" camp. I think the switch flipped for me when Snyder tweeted out the first picture.

I was in love with how awesome he looked, but definitely not an ardent supporter early on.

[DMBZeppelin]

Why was Lex a better detective than Batman in this movie?

[M. Steng]

Originally Posted by DMBZeppelin

Why was Lex a better detective than Batman in this movie?

Why do you continue to troll this thread asking stupid questions?

[KevinTH]

Originally Posted by KevinTH

I just think WB & DC are in this to cash some pay checks. It is a stupid idea to have Batman in the very first Superman sequel of a new Superman franchise. This shows to me that they just don't give a shit about what they're doing and they just want to get Justice League moving as fast as possible. Marvel let all their characters develop and come into their own before doing The Avengers. Iron Man was the lead off film and it got 2 sequels before moving on to Avengers. Superman is the lead off film and deserves the same treatment. I am a huge superhero fan so I'm a sucker and will see all of these movies but I'm not liking how this is playing out so far. Superman just deserves his own sequel before movng forward. As I said a couple weeks ago, it would be cool to have a quick Bruce Wayne cameo in the movie maybe at the end. Clark Kent goes to cover an event that Bruce Wayne is hosting and they are introduced...something like that. Then maybe a few Batman references thrown in there here and there.

Guess we'll see how this all plays out. I like Ben Affleck...but as Batman? Just doesn't fit. The dude really belongs BEHIND the camera.

As much as I loved BvS I still stand by the fact that another Superman movie first would have been a better idea. I didn't remember being so against Affleck though.

Originally Posted by hailtopitt

how is the bolded any different than what marvel does? how many more wolverine movies are we going to get? and they are all...just awful

this movie is also 2 years away from relsease, so let's cool it with the "they don't give a shit"

clearly you are very partial to marvel over DC, why not just say that and move on?

Boy was he wrong.

[M. Steng]

Is it really surprising, that the second-best comic book movie ever made, should be a topic of controversy?

[KevinTH]

Originally Posted by M. Steng

Is it really surprising, that the second-best comic book movie ever made, should be a topic of controversy?

We're talking about a movie whose very existence challenges our own sense of priority in the Universe.

[DMBZeppelin]

Originally Posted by M. Steng

Why do you continue to troll this thread asking stupid questions?

You go into every Marvel thread and bitch about DC movies. I asked a question about Lex being a better detective than Batman.

Just because I'm critical of this movie doesn't mean you have to be so butt hurt all the time. I actually like a majority of DC movies. I'm not sure why it bothers you so much.

Edit: Are you Zack Snyder?