Have you watched Seinfeld?

[scrock25]

Hakunah Mataters!!

[jjr4884]

Originally Posted by hailtopitt

not sure if that's true, actually. Seinfeld used a live studio audience.

i don't know how often a laugh track was used, if at all, by Seinfeld or other 90's sitcoms. they may have thrown in some laugh tracking in editing, but the episodes were filmed in front of live people.

maybe i'm not up to speed with technical terms but i'm assuming that "laugh track" included live audience laughing included in the aired episode.

[hailtopitt]

Originally Posted by jjr4884

maybe i'm not up to speed with technical terms but i'm assuming that "laugh track" included live audience laughing included in the aired episode.

oh ok maybe. i always thought live studio audience was considered different

for instance, something like the Big Bang Theory doesn't have an audience at all. Just an empty studio with stocked laughter added later on. it's painful. if you want to cringe, watch clips of The Big Bang Theory without the laugh track. it's unbearable.

[TheLastPig]

Originally Posted by hailtopitt

oh ok maybe. i always thought live studio audience was considered different

for instance, something like the Big Bang Theory doesn't have an audience at all. Just an empty studio with stocked laughter added later on. it's painful. if you want to cringe, watch The Big Bang Theory. it's unbearable.

Fixed that for you.

That show is trash.

[hailtopitt]

Originally Posted by TheLastPig

Fixed that for you.

That show is trash.

very true

[SmoothG]

I'm still lol'ing at the idea of lost being a top 5 show of all time.

[DaveHead36]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

Like Fawlty Towers and The Young Ones it aced what it tried to do and got out of there before it got stale.

Fawlty Towers - 12 episodes
The Young Ones - 12 episodes
The Office - 12 episodes + 2 xmas specials
Extras - 12 episodes + xmas special

Extras is absolutely hilarious and brilliant also but pushed I'd give a nod to The Office overall.

Yup, I think one of the things that makes British TV so great is they typically have 6-7 shows in a season/series. Because of this the original writers usually end up doing the entirety of a shows run, giving it a more consistent vibe.

[scrock25]

Originally Posted by SmoothG

I'm still lol'ing at the idea of lost being a top 5 show of all time.

Cool story smoothletter!!

[AJF_41]

Originally Posted by sbuzzz

This is totally the truth, and why it "holds up" and is the best show ever.

my man




lost

[zajDmB1]

Seinfeld not overrated. One of the best shows ever.

Lost...eh, could go either way. Overall it was a great show, but was also its own worst enemy.

[mr.MikeD]

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

Seinfeld not overrated. One of the best shows ever.

Lost...eh, could go either way. Overall it was a great show, but was also its own worst enemy.

agreed - "i don't like Seinfeld, it's not my thing" is reasonable. Seinfeld is bad or overrated not reasonable and is dumb.

I fee like Lost (other than the first couple of seasons) had good episodes and characters and a bad overall story that ended really badly.

[laverwater]

Originally Posted by YouNeverKnow25

the office was not a cable tv show

I think I, as well as most others I encounter, mix these up 90% of the time. Most people usually understand.

Growing up, cable to me meant anything outside of the basic 12 or so channels. Those 12 only needed an antenna, not a "cable". Apparently I was wrong!

Originally Posted by hailtopitt

not sure if that's true, actually. Seinfeld used a live studio audience.

i don't know how often a laugh track was used, if at all, by Seinfeld or other 90's sitcoms. they may have thrown in some laugh tracking in editing, but the episodes were filmed in front of live people.

Most of it definitely was live. Though I wonder how they got laughter in the street scenes and other obscure locations. Did they show those clips on the screens in the studio?

[SmoothG]

Originally Posted by scrock25

Cool story smoothletter!!

Hansel: So I'm rappelling down Mount Vesuvius when suddenly I slip, and I start to fall. Just falling, ahh, ahh. I'll never forget the terror. When suddenly I realize, "Holy shit, Hansel, haven't you been smoking peyote for six straight days and couldn't some of this maybe be in your mind?"

Derek Zoolander: And?

Hansel: And it was. I was totally fine. I've never even been to Mount Vesuvius.

Finnish Dwarf: Cool story Hansel.

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

Seinfeld not overrated. One of the best shows ever.

Lost...eh, could go either way. Overall it was a great show, but was also its own worst enemy.

Originally Posted by mr.MikeD

agreed - "i don't like Seinfeld, it's not my thing" is reasonable. Seinfeld is bad or overrated not reasonable and is dumb.

I fee like Lost (other than the first couple of seasons) had good episodes and characters and a bad overall story that ended really badly.

Spot on posts.

[hailtopitt]

Originally Posted by laverwater

Most of it definitely was live. Though I wonder how they got laughter in the street scenes and other obscure locations. Did they show those clips on the screens in the studio?

that's a good question

maybe they showed them on screens to the studio audience or maybe some of the "street" scenes weren't really on the street and were actually in the studio anyway

[DaveHead36]

Originally Posted by laverwater

I think I, as well as most others I encounter, mix these up 90% of the time. Most people usually understand.

Growing up, cable to me meant anything outside of the basic 12 or so channels. Those 12 only needed an antenna, not a "cable". Apparently I was wrong!



Most of it definitely was live. Though I wonder how they got laughter in the street scenes and other obscure locations. Did they show those clips on the screens in the studio?

The Parking Garage was the first Seinfeld episode not to use a live studio audience while filming but I think Larry David refused to use a laugh track so they ended up cutting the episode and screening it for the audience and using their laughter/reactions for the broadcast.

I think I remember a commentary about the street scenes saying they either showed the clips like they did for Parking Garage or had the actors act the scene out on set and used the audience noise from that.

None of show was canned laughter though. During or after season 4 they had to remind the audience not to go wild during a Kramer entrance because it was throwing off the timing of the bits and also eating up valuable seconds of story time.

[neumdogg]

Lost

[defcon]

I think I've seen about every episode, but I'm not sure. I base this on the late 90s, when Seinfeld reruns were in syndication and the local station had a Seinfeld marathon. I was sick, on some gnarly stuff, and was awake for about 5 days straight, more or less, and I'm pretty sure I binged watched most if not all of the series during this time. When I do see a Seinfeld episode on, almost never have I ever not seen it.

I thought it was funny then, and still is now. It describes New Yorkers to a T. All the neurosis, craziness, and hilarity.

I would LOVE to see a one-off reunion show, like a two hour special with an hour long episode and an hour or so Q and A. Everyone is still around, so it could happen...in my dreams.

[scrock25]

Originally Posted by neumdogg

Lost

[TwoStep2888]

Lost vs Seinfeld is a weird vs, it's apples and oranges

[DaveHead36]

Originally Posted by TwoStep2888

Lost vs Seinfeld is a weird vs, it's apples and oranges

Both shows about nothing? ZING!

[scrock25]

Originally Posted by TwoStep2888

Lost vs Seinfeld is a weird vs, it's apples and oranges

It is, but I don't think anybody is actually comparing the shows, maybe just their place on a list.

[jmkratt]

The best part of Seinfeld was the bass line.

[zajDmB1]

Originally Posted by mr.MikeD

agreed - "i don't like Seinfeld, it's not my thing" is reasonable. Seinfeld is bad or overrated not reasonable and is dumb.

I fee like Lost (other than the first couple of seasons) had good episodes and characters and a bad overall story that ended really badly.

The problem with Lost, I think, and from what I've gathered reading things over the years from writers, show runners, etc, is that the general idea of Lost was set from the beginning, but two major things happened.

1) People correctly guessed one of the major plot points so they actually rewrote it slightly. Lindeloff (?, whatever his name was) confirmed this in an interview once. I don't think it changed the whole story in a major way but it was enough. I forget exactly what it was but it was related to the whole purgatory idea.

2) Not knowing how long the show was going to last. I think the idea they had was that it was be 4 seasons or so, so when it kept going they had to add more and more stories, which they then could not keep up with. They ended up giving it too many random 'mysteries' to keep the allure of the show, but then they just kinda bogged themselves down.

I still enjoyed it but it's the perfect argument for shows that are like 'ok, we're two seasons, that's it. That's all i need to tell this story. If it's the most popular show ever, oh well, not gonna go on longer.'

[scrock25]

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

The problem with Lost, I think, and from what I've gathered reading things over the years from writers, show runners, etc, is that the general idea of Lost was set from the beginning, but two major things happened.

1) People correctly guessed one of the major plot points so they actually rewrote it slightly. Lindeloff (?, whatever his name was) confirmed this in an interview once. I don't think it changed the whole story in a major way but it was enough. I forget exactly what it was but it was related to the whole purgatory idea.

2) Not knowing how long the show was going to last. I think the idea they had was that it was be 4 seasons or so, so when it kept going they had to add more and more stories, which they then could not keep up with. They ended up giving it too many random 'mysteries' to keep the allure of the show, but then they just kinda bogged themselves down.

I still enjoyed it but it's the perfect argument for shows that are like 'ok, we're two seasons, that's it. That's all i need to tell this story. If it's the most popular show ever, oh well, not gonna go on longer.'

I've never heard #1, would love to read more about it... do you have an article you can cite? I know that there's a common misconception out there that the whole show WAS purgatory, which is false, but I've never heard that they had to re-write it because fans guessed what was going on.

#2, you're right, they didn't ever know how long the show was going to be - there was nothing ever stated from the get go that the show was only going to be 4 seasons, nobody had any idea when the end game was going to be. The episode about Jack in the Philippines as well as the writers strike helped the production team to decide to end it after 6 seasons - especially because at that point in the series that had some semblance of an idea about where they were headed. They've all been quoted as saying that they didn't want the show to end up like the X-Files or Happy Days where it just goes on and on.

[ShotgunDMB]

Never could get into Lost. Just seemed so hokey and corny.

[TheLastStop123]

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

The problem with Lost, I think, and from what I've gathered reading things over the years from writers, show runners, etc, is that the general idea of Lost was set from the beginning, but two major things happened.

1) People correctly guessed one of the major plot points so they actually rewrote it slightly. Lindeloff (?, whatever his name was) confirmed this in an interview once. I don't think it changed the whole story in a major way but it was enough. I forget exactly what it was but it was related to the whole purgatory idea.

2) Not knowing how long the show was going to last. I think the idea they had was that it was be 4 seasons or so, so when it kept going they had to add more and more stories, which they then could not keep up with. They ended up giving it too many random 'mysteries' to keep the allure of the show, but then they just kinda bogged themselves down.

I still enjoyed it but it's the perfect argument for shows that are like 'ok, we're two seasons, that's it. That's all i need to tell this story. If it's the most popular show ever, oh well, not gonna go on longer.'

Originally Posted by scrock25

I've never heard #1, would love to read more about it... do you have an article you can cite? I know that there's a common misconception out there that the whole show WAS purgatory, which is false, but I've never heard that they had to re-write it because fans guessed what was going on.

#2, you're right, they didn't ever know how long the show was going to be - there was nothing ever stated from the get go that the show was only going to be 4 seasons, nobody had any idea when the end game was going to be. The episode about Jack in the Philippines as well as the writers strike helped the production team to decide to end it after 6 seasons - especially because at that point in the series that had some semblance of an idea about where they were headed. They've all been quoted as saying that they didn't want the show to end up like the X-Files or Happy Days where it just goes on and on.

I guess maybe because it's been awhile since I watched it, but my interpretation of it was that it WAS purgatory, because I specifically remember a clip in one of the final episodes that showed the plane crash with no survivors (i.e. they were always dead the whole time in purgatory). I guess that's not true though according to a 2014 interview with Lindelof:

http://www.eonline.com/news/521687/l...ole-show-about

edit: there seemed to be mixed articles about what the writers ultimately wanted the ending to be, and I stand by the fact that they never really knew what they wanted to do with it.

[dobyblue]

I don't recall them ever stating that they rewrote the arc because people guessed it.

I do recall that they wanted 6 seasons and ABC wanted 8. Around the middle of Season 3 ABC asked "WTF was that" about one of the episodes and they said "that's an 8 season show" and that's when ABC said "fine, write it your way".

I believe the episode they cite specifically is Stranger in a Strange Land.

"[The Nikki and Paolo arc] was an example of a story idea where once we'd initiated it we regretted having done it," Cuse told Esquire. "Or, on a smaller scale, when we told the story of Jack flashing back to Thailand and how he got his tattoos, we really regretted that we had decided that was a worthy flashback story. That story became really instrumental in convincing ABC that we needed to end the show. We were like, 'Okay, this is what flashbacks look like now so it's probably a good idea if we figure out how much longer this show is actually going to go.'"

And when asked point blank which episode was the worst of the series, Cuse pointed to the latter story.

"I think it's cringe-worthy, where [Jack]'s flying the kite on the beach," Cuse said. "It was not our finest hour. We used Matthew Fox's real tattoos. That's how desperate we were for flashback stories."

https://www.moviefone.com/2014/05/08...-lost-episode/

It's interesting too that they acknowledge how the actors shaped some of the series. Michael Emerson apparently originally signed on for only 3 episodes and it was Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje wanting off the show (they planned on a longer story arc for Mr. Eko) that opened up more for Ben's character.

Emerson is fantastic in everything he does, so that worked out well.

[Dramageek]

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

The problem with Lost, I think, and from what I've gathered reading things over the years from writers, show runners, etc, is that the general idea of Lost was set from the beginning, but two major things happened.

1) People correctly guessed one of the major plot points so they actually rewrote it slightly. Lindeloff (?, whatever his name was) confirmed this in an interview once. I don't think it changed the whole story in a major way but it was enough. I forget exactly what it was but it was related to the whole purgatory idea.

2) Not knowing how long the show was going to last. I think the idea they had was that it was be 4 seasons or so, so when it kept going they had to add more and more stories, which they then could not keep up with. They ended up giving it too many random 'mysteries' to keep the allure of the show, but then they just kinda bogged themselves down.

I still enjoyed it but it's the perfect argument for shows that are like 'ok, we're two seasons, that's it. That's all i need to tell this story. If it's the most popular show ever, oh well, not gonna go on longer.'

I don't even think they had that.

http://grantland.com/features/alan-s...-origins-lost/

With Lost, the first season I thought was excellent, the second kind of pretty good, then it went downhill from there (though I did enjoy bits and pieces along the way.)

[MOWJO8185]

Didn't backread to see why Lost is being discussed, but I've only watched a handful of Seinfeld episodes. I was just a little too young during its initial broadcast run to get it. I've seen episodes here and there since then and have really enjoyed it, but diving into the whole series seems daunting, especially when I know my wife won't like it which means I'd have to find the time to watch it solo.

I did watch all of Lost, and the first season will always stand out to me as one of the most ambitious shows ever on a broadcast network. It definitely got a little ridiculous in the later years, but by then you were in love with the characters and just determined to know what the fuck was going on, so there was no way I was jumping off.

[chadizzy1]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

I don't recall them ever stating that they rewrote the arc because people guessed it.

I do recall that they wanted 6 seasons and ABC wanted 8. Around the middle of Season 3 ABC asked "WTF was that" about one of the episodes and they said "that's an 8 season show" and that's when ABC said "fine, write it your way".

I believe the episode they cite specifically is Stranger in a Strange Land.



https://www.moviefone.com/2014/05/08...-lost-episode/

It's interesting too that they acknowledge how the actors shaped some of the series. Michael Emerson apparently originally signed on for only 3 episodes and it was Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje wanting off the show (they planned on a longer story arc for Mr. Eko) that opened up more for Ben's character.

Emerson is fantastic in everything he does, so that worked out well.

Those were the two worst episodes. Nikki & Paulo (Expose, I think?) and Stranger in a Strange Land. Usually I'll skim through those on a rewatch and keep up with the on island stuff, not the flashback stuff.