Official Fuck the Police thread

[justink]

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

Why not tase or rubber bullet guns?

policies and procedures.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tueller_Drill

[JRS1386]

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

Why not tase or rubber bullet guns?

I'm sorry but if someone has a knife out at cops they lose the right to being tasered

[JRS1386]

Also, tasering doesn't guarantee the guy will go do before you are stabbed

[Lcsulla]

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

Why not tase or rubber bullet guns?

Rubber bullets are not a standard load out for police and the ones that are virtually non-lethal are used with a specific firearm, not a service sidearm. Tasering is an inexact science inasmuch as it will not always stop an aggressor if the electricity is delivered below the neck. I also do not know which type of taser the officers down there carry, contact or darts. If it is a contact taser it can be rather dangerous to get close enough to use against a knife wielding suspect. In truth I do not know enough about the circumstances to know whether deadly force was necessary, I am just relating what I know.

[justink]

If a knife carrying suspect crosses within 21 feet of someone, they are going to get shot.

That's protocol.

It's also why taser leads are only 21 feet as well. Taser doesn't want to get sued for an officer being killed by a knife wielding suspect when the officer should have shot him instead of deploying a taser.

A knife is automatically escalated to lethal force.

[zajDmB1]

The taser thing makes sense to me, sure, but what what you said about rubber bullets, Jamie, doesn't really explain why they don't use them. I understand having to prepare for the worst, i.e. fight live rounds with live rounds, but there's also a lot of instances where it'd probably be better off not using them.

In the past few years there's been a number of instances where the NYPD ended up shooting a bunch of bystanders because apparently target practice isn't required. One, the ESB one, they were like 10 feet away and shot like 6 other people. Some dude with a knife in TS was shot like 20 times because apparently 30 NYPD can't take down 1 dude any other way. And then some other guy near TS, who ended up only having a piece of cardboard or something was shot along with 2 or 3 bystanders. Even if you say fuck the dudes the cops are responding to, maybe protect all the random innocents by giving them at worst a bruise or broken bone as opposed to a hole in their body or possible death, which has also happened.

[ExistenceNow]

I don't think I would bet my life that a rubber bullet would stop a charging man with a knife before he has the chance to stab me.

[justink]

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

The taser thing makes sense to me, sure, but what what you said about rubber bullets, Jamie, doesn't really explain why they don't use them. I understand having to prepare for the worst, i.e. fight live rounds with live rounds, but there's also a lot of instances where it'd probably be better off not using them.

In the past few years there's been a number of instances where the NYPD ended up shooting a bunch of bystanders because apparently target practice isn't required. One, the ESB one, they were like 10 feet away and shot like 6 other people. Some dude with a knife in TS was shot like 20 times because apparently 30 NYPD can't take down 1 dude any other way. And then some other guy near TS, who ended up only having a piece of cardboard or something was shot along with 2 or 3 bystanders. Even if you say fuck the dudes the cops are responding to, maybe protect all the random innocents by giving them at worst a bruise or broken bone as opposed to a hole in their body or possible death, which has also happened.

If cops carried a shotgun with rubber bullets or bean bags around to every call "just in case", there would be an insane backlash much more than the already "over militarized" ones.

And nypd aren't necessarily bad shots, it's that the stupid law makers up there decided that they have to replace the normal three pound trigger in their pistols with super heavy 13.5 pound triggers. Because they're "safer", naturally. Next time you go to the gym, try finger curling 13.5 pounds.

But shortsighted law making being what it is, a heavy trigger pull makes it harder to shoot accurately under stress and bullets start flying all over the place rather than on target.

[Lcsulla]

Originally Posted by zajDmB1

but what what you said about rubber bullets, Jamie, doesn't really explain why they don't use them. I understand having to prepare for the worst, i.e. fight live rounds with live rounds, but there's also a lot of instances where it'd probably be better off not using them.

The concept of rubber bullets is all good and well on paper but in reality if sidearms could use them (they just do not work with rifled barrels) but in reality it is absurd. Some of the criminals they deal with are armed with lethal weapons, arming an officer with anything short of equal firepower is both irresponsible and dangerous. As for knives, officers are not trained to use them so they pull their sidearms. When someone pulls a lethal weapon on a law enforcement officer it is natural for the officer to respond in kind. Basically it is my belief that if you threaten an officer with a lethal weapon you and your supporters loose the moral high ground and forfeit your right to bitch about the consequences.

[drop2d]

Don't underestimate the knife:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9igSoJHEdUo

[justink]

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=324088361392

[zajDmB1]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...0GL2DL20140821

[Lee3691]

^
I've read, but have not confirmed, that occupation with the most sexual assaults are LEOs. Would like to know if that is really true.

[Lee3691]

http://m.theatlantic.com/national/ar...-black/379357/

Let's see what the law enforcement apologists say about this one

[dre2142]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

http://m.theatlantic.com/national/ar...-black/379357/

Let's see what the law enforcement apologists say about this one

devils advocate here.....forgetting about why the police showed up in the first place...what is so hard with just identifying yourself to a police officer?

Instead of instantly pulling out the race card, why not just tell them your name and not even let it escalate to where it went to?

I dont buy the "well, its your right not to identify yourself to a police officer"...... who cares? tell them your name and continue on with your day.

As a police officer, they are just supposed to believe what anyone tells them and to say "oh, ok....youre telling me that you are here for a legitimate reason, go on with your day"? How did the officer know he was telling the truth??

[jcc522]

Originally Posted by dre2142

devils advocate here.....forgetting about why the police showed up in the first place...what is so hard with just identifying yourself to a police officer?

Instead of instantly pulling out the race card, why not just tell them your name and not even let it escalate to where it went to?

I dont buy the "well, its your right not to identify yourself to a police officer"...... who cares? tell them your name and continue on with your day.

As a police officer, they are just supposed to believe what anyone tells them and to say "oh, ok....youre telling me that you are here for a legitimate reason, go on with your day"? How did the officer know he was telling the truth??

Did the officer have RAS he had, was, or was going to commit a crime? If not, then she can fuck off. He was minding his own business and she interrupted his day.

[Lee3691]

Originally Posted by dre2142

devils advocate here.....forgetting about why the police showed up in the first place...what is so hard with just identifying yourself to a police officer?

Instead of instantly pulling out the race card, why not just tell them your name and not even let it escalate to where it went to?

I dont buy the "well, its your right not to identify yourself to a police officer"...... who cares? tell them your name and continue on with your day.

As a police officer, they are just supposed to believe what anyone tells them and to say "oh, ok....youre telling me that you are here for a legitimate reason, go on with your day"? How did the officer know he was telling the truth??

You don't buy that someone should not exercise their constitutional rights? He should of asked if he was being detained or free to go, and the reason. Pretty heart breaking hearing from the guy who needed to get his kids.

I posted that as an example of why certain minorities feel the way they do towards law enforcement.

[dre2142]

Constitutional rights.......I believe in practicality and that telling a police officer your name isnt that crazy of a thing to do.

I posted that as an example of why certain minorities feel the way they do towards law enforcement.

Which came first...the chicken or the egg.....

[Kevaroo]

I have no idea what led to the confrontation. But if you are picking up your children why wouldn't you just do what you have to do to make sure you see your kids? Regardless if the cops had a reasonable reason to ask the man to simply identify himself, why wouldn't you just to make sure you do your duty as a parent? I've been asked to identify myself, probably when it wasn't required, I just did it.

[dre2142]

Originally Posted by kevaroo

i have no idea what led to the confrontation. But if you are picking up your children why wouldn't you just do what you have to do to make sure you see your kids? Regardless if the cops had a reasonable reason to ask the man to simply identify himself, why wouldn't you just to make sure you do your duty as a parent? I've been asked to identify myself, probably when it wasn't required, i just did it.

but your rights man!!!! Your rights!!!!!!!

[AJF_41]

seems like another bs police officer on a power trip

the fact that he was black didn't help

agree he could have given id - - but that's not the point

[jcc522]

Originally Posted by dre2142

but your rights man!!!! Your rights!!!!!!!

Would you be okay with randomly being pulled over to have your name(not DL) checked?

[rconverse]

Originally Posted by jcc522

Would you be okay with randomly being pulled over to have your name(not DL) checked?

Don't we all do that when we come across a police DUI choke point? When you get to those, you're asked for DL, license, proof of insurance, etc... Most people aren't doing anything wrong.

[jcc522]

Originally Posted by rconverse

Don't we all do that when we come across a police DUI choke point? When you get to those, you're asked for DL, license, proof of insurance, etc... Most people aren't doing anything wrong.

No, we all don't.

Your willingness to be molested contributes to these fishing expeditions.

[rconverse]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

http://m.theatlantic.com/national/ar...-black/379357/

Let's see what the law enforcement apologists say about this one

So stupid. Of course we get this in the middle. Clearly there was something that happened before the camera started rolling. The cop even said that when they get called, they have to follow procedure. Now, whether that guy was literally sitting there and completely minding his own business and some crazy person came over and starting getting "irate" with him, no one knows. Something tells me that's not completely the case.

So, there was clearly a reason for the cop to ask for his ID. Clearly. After that, he was asked several, several times to please comply. He made poor decision after poor decision. Next, the other officers come over and they're probably thinking that this guy is taking advantage of a very polite female officer. Again, if we allow people to tell cops when they will and will not comply with their requests, why even have them? Best thing he could have done was keep his camera going and shown his ID.

[rconverse]

Originally Posted by jcc522

No, we all don't.

Your willingness to be molested contributes to these fishing expeditions.

Oh, right. I'm sure when you pull up to one of those, you tell the officer "I know my rights" and they let you just drive on thru.


Newsflash: Driving is not a right, it's a privilege.

[AJF_41]

Originally Posted by rconverse

So stupid. Of course we get this in the middle. Clearly there was something that happened before the camera started rolling. The cop even said that when they get called, they have to follow procedure. Now, whether that guy was literally sitting there and completely minding his own business and some crazy person came over and starting getting "irate" with him, no one knows. Something tells me that's not completely the case.

So, there was clearly a reason for the cop to ask for his ID. Clearly. After that, he was asked several, several times to please comply. He made poor decision after poor decision. Next, the other officers come over and they're probably thinking that this guy is taking advantage of a very polite female officer. Again, if we allow people to tell cops when they will and will not comply with their requests, why even have them? Best thing he could have done was keep his camera going and shown his ID.

come on rog

they were called because he was "sitting where he wasn't supposed to"
this wasn't a car jacking...robbery...violent act they were investigating

let's use the smell test on this one

there was no reason for the second cop to come up and take him to the ground..then tase him..

you can hear his kid in the background



shitty cop on a power trip

[neumdogg]

Originally Posted by Lee3691

http://m.theatlantic.com/national/ar...-black/379357/

Let's see what the law enforcement apologists say about this one

All he had to do was show his ID and comply. The arrest was probably unwarranted. However, you don't resist arrest. It's that simple.

[dre2142]

Originally Posted by AJF_41

come on rog

they were called because he was "sitting where he wasn't supposed to"
this wasn't a car jacking...robbery...violent act they were investigating

let's use the smell test on this one

there was no reason for the second cop to come up and take him to the ground..then tase him..

you can hear his kid in the background



shitty cop on a power trip

and the lady cop was nice and had a smile on her face the entire time (there isnt even video evidence of her asking for his ID....only what his name was), and he was being argumentative and pulled the fucking race card. sorry, but i hate that shit.

its not the officers fault that someone ELSE called the police about him.

2nd cop didnt have to be a dick about it but this guy couldve handle it differently as well.

And in many states, yes, you HAVE to identify yourself.

[jcc522]

Originally Posted by rconverse

Oh, right. I'm sure when you pull up to one of those, you tell the officer "I know my rights" and they let you just drive on thru.


Newsflash: Driving is not a right, it's a privilege.

lol @ thinking I would actually engage in a DUI checkpoint. I get texts with the location of the checkpoints hours, if not days before the stops. If I didn't get a text, I don't drink and drive so I turn off before it or execute a legal three point turn.